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Thread: All things: GAME OF THRONES

  1. #1091
    Video Game First Liner Ecktore's Avatar




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    lol. I give up. Go on with your convo about Jaime's hair, republicans, democrats, political views, and current world society in this thread about a tv show. I'll leave you to it.


    But I'm keeping the high horse.

  2. #1092
    I'llPutPenniesOnYourEyes jerseydevil's Avatar




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    Quote Originally Posted by SmytheKing View Post
    ...and I think that's the issue. When rape is looked at as not as bad as possibly offending the dead, I get a little twisted.

    When someone says no (regardless of why) and the dude says "I don't care", it's pretty cut and dry to me. It was a poor decision anyway you look at it. That's the last I'll say about the rape scene. If you guys don't think it was, imagine it happening to a close female relative of yours and let me know if you'd be ok with how Jamie handled it. Would you say to her, "well, it was kind of ambiguous"? I doubt it.

    Also, I don't care if someone talks about the differences in the books either as long as it doesn't give away any future plot lines. As I told jd off the air, I've had Ned Stark dying, the Red Wedding, the Purple Wedding, Sansa being married off to Tyrion, AND two more big things spoiled for me that will be coming up in the future. I didn't need another thing ruined.

    OOOh see I don't think anyone discounted the rape. I think it was all just so overwhelmingly negative that by then most had morally checked out. It was like another number being called after someone wins 'Srsly F'd Up BINGO'.

  3. #1093
    Video Game First Liner Ecktore's Avatar




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    Quote Originally Posted by jerseydevil View Post
    Children...look, I corrected my statements and I should have KNOWN not to off handedly make a damned political throwaway reference. I wasn't trying to provoke, it was just an observation. Let's move on shall we? As Hodor would say...'Hodor?'
    Hodor!
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  4. #1094
    Hit it like a baby seal SmytheKing's Avatar




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    Quote Originally Posted by jerseydevil View Post
    OOOh see I don't think anyone discounted the rape. I think it was all just so overwhelmingly negative that by then most had morally checked out. It was like another number being called after someone wins 'Srsly F'd Up BINGO'.
    I would agree with you if people weren't so fast to tell me why it wasn't "actually" rape. If they were saying, "yeah, that just made it even worse" I could be on board with that. Instead, I'm hearing a lot of, "well, I don't know. she seemed to be into it." and other justifications.

  5. #1095
    Classic player VCRW's Avatar




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    Quote Originally Posted by SmytheKing View Post
    ...and I think that's the issue. When rape is looked at as not as bad as possibly offending the dead, I get a little twisted.
    You are applying morality from our world to the behavior in what is essentially an amoral world. I don't think anyone is condoning or overlooking rape as an act in our society. However, the series is not about our society. Singling out an act of violence against a woman is in contradiction to the world being depicted. In Martin's/HBO's GoT universe, all manner of violent actions are commonplace and are essential to the telling of the story. If I were judging the gross violence and disturbing inhumanity then I couldn't watch the show at all.
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  6. #1096
    Hit it like a baby seal SmytheKing's Avatar




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    Quote Originally Posted by VCRW View Post
    You are applying morality from our world to the behavior in what is essentially an amoral world. I don't think anyone is condoning or overlooking rape as an act in our society. However, the series is not about our society. Singling out an act of violence against a woman is in contradiction to the world being depicted. In Martin's/HBO's GoT universe, all manner of violent actions are commonplace and are essential to the telling of the story. If I were judging the gross violence and disturbing inhumanity then I couldn't watch the show at all.
    I'm not judging anyone on the show. I think it makes everything they said about Jamie last season seem insignificant and a waste of a good character arc. It's not like I'm going to stop watching because of my indignity about what happened. I just think it was a terrible way to turn the story considering it was totally unnecessary.

    I AM however judging people who tell me that what happened in that scene doesn't count as rape because it wasn't in an alley with a knife at her throat. There's a difference.
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  7. #1097
    #SimianNation mitchrock's Avatar




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    Keep the conversation civil and do NOT make is a political agenda.
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    #SimianNation mitchrock's Avatar




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    Hodor!
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  9. #1099
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    Quote Originally Posted by VCRW View Post
    You are applying morality from our world to the behavior in what is essentially an amoral world. I don't think anyone is condoning or overlooking rape as an act in our society. However, the series is not about our society. Singling out an act of violence against a woman is in contradiction to the world being depicted. In Martin's/HBO's GoT universe, all manner of violent actions are commonplace and are essential to the telling of the story. If I were judging the gross violence and disturbing inhumanity then I couldn't watch the show at all.
    For me, the problem isn't that a rape was depicted. Watching this show, we all know there's going to be some disturbing scenes, so it's really not out of place at all...as sad as that is. My problem is that all of these other scenes of violence are straight from the source material, which is understandable....George R. R. Martin's universe is violent and pretty ****ing sick. However, THIS instance of rape was deliberately added for shock value, when it goes totally against the source material and completely negates any character development that the book and the show were so far achieving.

    If George R. R. Martin didn't intend for it to be a rape scene, it shouldn't have been a rape scene. There's plenty of violence already. More didn't need to be added.
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  10. #1100
    I'llPutPenniesOnYourEyes jerseydevil's Avatar




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    George R. R. Martin Responds To That Controversial Game of Thrones Scene

    A scene involving the characters Cersei and Jaime in last Sunday's episode has provoked enormous controversy — and prompted the author to weigh in.
    Fansof both Game of Thrones the TV show and Game of Thrones the book series likely noticed a disturbing plot discrepancy between the two while watching Sunday night’s episode “Breaker of Chains,” when Jaime Lannister raped his sister Cersei beside the body of their dead son. While plot changes aren’t unheard of for the HBO show, what made this particular scene so controversial is that in George R. R. Martin’s book, the sex is portrayed as consensual (albeit still incestuous and horribly morbid).
    While the episode’s director Alex Graves told Vulture that the scene “was meant to be consensual,” viewers couldn’t justifiably argue that it was portrayed that way. Cersei says “no,” “don’t” and struggles throughout the entire scene. If consent was given, it didn’t make the final cut.
    After the episode set off both fans and critics, Martin himself has weighed in on the scene in the comments of his blog to speculate why the show chose to make such a change:

    “I think the “butterfly effect” that I have spoken of so often was at work here. In the novels, Jaime is not present at Joffrey’s death, and indeed, Cersei has been fearful that he is dead himself, that she has lost both the son and the father/ lover/ brother. And then suddenly Jaime is there before her. Maimed and changed, but Jaime nonetheless. Though the time and place is wildly inappropriate and Cersei is fearful of discovery, she is as hungry for him as he is for her.

    The whole dynamic is different in the show, where Jaime has been back for weeks at the least, maybe longer, and he and Cersei have been in each other’s company on numerous occasions, often quarreling. The setting is the same, but neither character is in the same place as in the books, which may be why Dan & David played the [scene] out differently. But that’s just my surmise; we never discussed this scene, to the best of my recollection.

    Martin has discussed his theory of “the butterfly effect” before, which centers on the idea that any deviation the show makes from his intricate plot will logically lead to further deviations later on. Regarding Jaime and Cersei’s scene, Martin keenly noted another crucial difference between the books and the TV series, namely that the books tell the story from different characters’ points of view. Due to the nature of television, scenes can’t quite be cast in that way:

    “I was writing the scene from Jaime’s POV, so the reader is inside his head, hearing his thoughts. On the TV show, the camera is necessarily external. You don’t know what anyone is thinking or feeling, just what they are saying and doing.

    If the show had retained some of Cersei’s dialogue from the books, it might have left a somewhat different impression — but that dialogue was very much shaped by the circumstances of the books, delivered by a woman who is seeing her lover again for the first time after a long while apart during which she feared he was dead. I am not sure it would have worked with the new timeline.

    That’s really all I can say on this issue. The scene was always intended to be disturbing… but I do regret if it has disturbed people for the wrong reasons.



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