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Thread: Superman v Batman/DC movies

  1. #321
    Hating ties is dumb. Dr. Naysay's Avatar




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    Quote Originally Posted by NastiMarvasti View Post
    And another thing I thought was stupid. Jor-El beats the crap out of Zod. I thought the dude was a General.
    The handling of Jor El, I thought, was one of the more lazily handled elements of this movie.

    Yes they managed to turn Jor El into a "BAD ASS!!!" but that not only contradicts the character that we're all sort of subconsciously aware that he is (more on that in a moment) but it also completely contradicts who we're told he would have to be by virtue of genetic implanting or whatever they wanted to call it.

    Now... you might say "but Doc... he and Lara (who was inexplicably cast by someone with a strong foreign accent) were rebels! They had a child outside the birthing kelp forrest! Of course he would be the kind of guy to acquire Bas Assery skills!"

    Well to you I would say "Show me that's who he is then". Don't just have him jumping off of CGI buildings and swimming amid fetal matrix tubes and riding CGI beasts around an apocalyptic background. Give me some idea of who he is as a man other than just "Superman's Bad Ass Dad!". Cut just a few minutes of CGI mind pulping action that establishes early and often that there are no stakes other than the ones we're all programmed to anticipate (spoiler alert : Krypton dies). Let's see Jor El fighting with the council about stuff for more than like... 5 seconds. Let's see some consequences of his actions on his life that would have continued had Krypton not gone boom.

    Or maybe they did show it and I just couldn't concentrate on it because Zod instantly shows up and now there's clearly a relationship between he and Jor El that we are told about but don't really get to see.

    More examples of this movie just telling us "Trust us you guys..... this moment is really super important. You don't have to feel it or be shown any evidence of it... just trust us. This is bad ass."

    And this is where we revisit the idea of our subconscious recognition of these characters and tropes.

    Superman is 75 years old. That's like.... old and ****. And he's been depicted in TV shows, comics, movies, novels, cartoons, mugs, clothes, references, commercials....
    EVERYBODY knows the basics of Superman.

    Born on Krypton. Scientist dad builds rocket. Puts kid in it. Krypton explodes.
    Smallville. Kansas.
    Metropolos. Lois Lane.
    Punching.
    Cape.
    Red Undies outside.

    All of that is hardwired into our cultural awareness of Superman. This movie didn't do anything with Perry White or the Daily Planet... but the were in there because we all know who/what they are and it makes it feel more like a Supeman movie to us and this movie leans on that heavily.

    FOR EXAMPLE.............. I don't remember but does Man of Steel ever explicitly tell us who Jor El is? What his responsibilities are? How does he fit into the Kryptonian world? What's his title?

    None of these questions are addressed by the filmmakers with any kind of detail because A) more punching and B) we all know who Jor El is at some level so why bother wasting time on exposition or character development.
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  2. #322
    I'llPutPenniesOnYourEyes jerseydevil's Avatar




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    Generals issue orders from a desk. Meh. Jor-El was a scientist man...a scientist. And a tree hugger and a pacifist. You know he got his ass kicked as a kid.


    Um...and Russell Crowe.

    Really man, have you never seen South Park.

  3. #323
    Hating ties is dumb. Dr. Naysay's Avatar




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    Quote Originally Posted by jerseydevil View Post
    Generals issue orders from a desk. Meh. Jor-El was a scientist man...a scientist. And a tree hugger and a pacifist. You know he got his ass kicked as a kid.


    Um...and Russell Crowe.

    Really man, have you never seen South Park.
    I'm just sayin.....

    Casting Kevin Costner was a genius play too. They didn't really have to have Pa Kent do much (even though they could and should have) because most of us adults come into the movie with Field of Dreams tucked into our subconscious and teenagers don't care about boring **** like consistency or character development.
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  4. #324
    I'llPutPenniesOnYourEyes jerseydevil's Avatar




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    Damn you are agreeable today you mad bastard.

  5. #325
    I'llPutPenniesOnYourEyes jerseydevil's Avatar




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    btw...Nasti...how easy is it, at this juncture, for Nolan to take a 'hindsight is 20/20' view. Now, since the critiques have hit...he is divorcing himself from the decision making process. Meanwhile, his name is still prominently featured and I am sure he has a few checks deposited. It's asinine to sit there and say...'oh he had misgivings and did not sign off on this'. C'mon...you are a tremendously smart cat. And yet you are buying into his 'back towards the door' retreat.

  6. #326
    Hating ties is dumb. Dr. Naysay's Avatar




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    Last edited by Dr. Naysay; June 22nd, 2013 at 10:16 PM.

  7. #327
    4th Line Rabble-Rouser beedee's Avatar




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    i saw it last night. im far from a superman buff, so i don't know squat about the ins and outs about the story line. but i do work in advertising and the 7-Eleven, IHOP, SEARS and Nikon brand placement was really over the top...especially the 7-Eleven.
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  8. #328
    Hating ties is dumb. Dr. Naysay's Avatar




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    Quote Originally Posted by beedee View Post
    i saw it last night. im far from a superman buff, so i don't know squat about the ins and outs about the story line. but i do work in advertising and the 7-Eleven, IHOP, SEARS and Nikon brand placement was really over the top...especially the 7-Eleven.
    You know it's funny... I didn't even notice the 7-11 stuff.

    But IHOP? IHOP gets a name check AND tons of logo placement. Like... Pete ****ing Ross... A GODDAMNED CHARACTER FROM SUPERMAN CANNON.... SUPERMANS BEST CHILDHOOD BUDDY works at IHOP.

    He's not his best friend anymore.... he's a god damned IHOP employee.

    Given that they had Steve Lombard in the stupid movie I'm surprised we didn't see Lana Lang in a Sears vest at some point.
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  9. #329
    Let's hug it out, bitch! NastiMarvasti's Avatar




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    Quote Originally Posted by jerseydevil View Post
    btw...Nasti...how easy is it, at this juncture, for Nolan to take a 'hindsight is 20/20' view. Now, since the critiques have hit...he is divorcing himself from the decision making process. Meanwhile, his name is still prominently featured and I am sure he has a few checks deposited. It's asinine to sit there and say...'oh he had misgivings and did not sign off on this'. C'mon...you are a tremendously smart cat. And yet you are buying into his 'back towards the door' retreat.
    Underdevelopment and too much action are pretty much the opposite critiques of Nolan's movies though. That and the fact that he's been saying he's had no input after the treatment since production. I doubt the guy is that much of a douche to throw others under the bus when his movies fail.
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  10. #330
    I'llPutPenniesOnYourEyes jerseydevil's Avatar




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    I don't. I think he's a tremendous douche.

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