Thread: Kovalchuk is a NJ Devil. Now, get over it already.

Originally Posted by 22Sargent

I can't comment on his tweets, but, from my recollection of watching last season's trade deadline show on NHL Network (carrying TSN's feed), he was breaking the news of trades just as fast if not faster than Bob McKenzie. So, unless I'm not remembering accurately, he must be fairly well connected around the league.

That's alot different than reporting on rumors of trades that haven't occured yet.

Originally Posted by CUP4LA

Although JT would disagree with me, acquiring Kovalchuk would make the Kings an immediate contender. That as it may be, I'm not keen on trading Schenn or Bernier to get him.

"Contender", sure. I just think it is an awfully tall order to expect a bunch of kids who have never played in a playoff game to run the postseason gauntlet and win it all.

We've spent all this time building up the makings of what is supposed to be a consistent playoff team for the foreseeable future; why put so much on the line THIS season?

Kovalchuk won't be nearly as expensive if he is unsigned or doesn't have an agreement in place with a team at the time of the trade. You really are looking at a rental player and there is no way we give up more then Frolov, our first, and one midlevel prospect like Moeller or Voinov. Heck there is a good chance Atlanta will settle for less then that. More like a first, second, and a midlevel prospect if they can't get a deal done. Also I think we would trade Quick before we trade Bernier. He is the future goaltender for the franchise.

Originally Posted by Bandit

You'd trade 7 years for about 20 games?

huh?

No...

what?

EDIT -

Wait, just reread the last two pages...

What i MEANT... is if i was looking to make a deal for Kovy, id include Schenn as a component in second.
I have ZERO interest in Kovy as a rental, that makes no sense whatsoever. Only way id support any package for "rent-an-Ilya" would be a couple picks, and maybe on of our depth d prospects.

But for a handshake deal where he was signable for just an arm (leg withheld) - Schenn is gone faster than a cupcake in Carnie Wilson's dressing room.

I think my mistake was putting my "damn guys overrate this Schenn kid" post in this Kovy thread...

Sorry for the confusion... onward!~

Are we really discussing whether Darren Dregger is a credible source?

Twitter = blogger

Bloggers suck.

Dregger reported at the draft that Lombardi was shopping Visnovsky, which later happened.
That being said, he also had a few false reports.

Originally Posted by capnking

Kovalchuk won't be nearly as expensive if he is unsigned or doesn't have an agreement in place with a team at the time of the trade. You really are looking at a rental player and there is no way we give up more then Frolov, our first, and one midlevel prospect like Moeller or Voinov. Heck there is a good chance Atlanta will settle for less then that. More like a first, second, and a midlevel prospect if they can't get a deal done. Also I think we would trade Quick before we trade Bernier. He is the future goaltender for the franchise.

Not likely, considering that teams like Boston are going to be able to put together a package with young players, prospects and picks that are easily better than a pending UFA, a pick and a mid-level. jt has been pretty accurate with his assessment all along of what this deal will take from the Kings:

-A current young top 6 forward (legit top 6 forward and NOT Frolov)
-A high/mid-to-high level top 6 forward (or perhaps a d-man) prospect about ready to play NHL minutes
-Another high/mid-to-high level prospect (e.g. Teubert)
-1st rounder

Something else for those thinking about signing him long-term to consider. It has been mentioned several times by Waddell and the AJC that Kovalchuk is NOT interested in signing a front-loaded long-term contract, he is seeking the relatively same dollar amount each year over the duration of the contract. So no Hossa or Franzen type deals where he'll make $500k over the last two years to lower the cap hit. Whether that remains true by the time he finally signs somewhere, <shrug>.

Originally Posted by gretzky99

moller is now playing on the 2nd line. i do agree that he wasn't very good last year and then got injured and didn't seemed ready to go this year. but he's played much better after his recent call-up and looks much stronger on the puck than he ever has.

and imo there's no way ATL got more than filppula, franzen and prospect. unless esposito turns out to be something special, ATL didn't get much in that deal.

Moller is getting one game on the top line. I hope he succeeds and plays the rest of the season there. But remember Ivanans got a couple games on the top line too and Purcell played quite a few there.

If you look at the players at the time the trade was made, there wasn't much difference between the Pens players and the Wings players. And it's going to be impossible to compare now because Esposito and Christensen have had so many injuries (which can't possibly be factored in while looking back in 20/20 hindsight).

Originally Posted by CUP4LA

Isn't he on the second line now?

See above.

Originally Posted by USCKingsFan31

Personally, I don't really want Kovalchuk. Even if some of the packages discussed in this thread might be exaggerated, when considering the name involved and the bidding of other teams, there is no way we land the guy without giving up quite a bit, even if we "can afford to".

I agree. Just because I have enough money in my wallet doesn't mean I should buy a bra, even if it's the nicest bra ever made and it's only $1. I don't need a bra.

Trading multiple prospects and picks for an expensive rental doesn't make sense to me considering we are still a year or two away from a legitimate cup run.

I agree, although I do think this is the right year to make a move to help these guys go deeper in the playoffs than if they don't make a move. Whether that's Whitney or Stillman or Torres or Kovalchuk I don't know. But trading prospect assets to get the asset of going deep in the playoffs is worth it.

Originally Posted by CUP4LA

Although JT would disagree with me, acquiring Kovalchuk would make the Kings an immediate contender. That as it may be, I'm not keen on trading Schenn or Bernier to get him.

I think you're wrong, but truthfully I don't know. There's guys I know stuff about and guys I don't. I don't really know that much about Kovalchuk. I know what my buddy in Atlanta tells me, but the Thrashers have sucked so many years that who really knows what a Kovalchuk that's motivated by a UFA contract and the prospect of going deep in the playoffs could do? Optimistically, he could lead the playoffs in scoring...but he could also slack off because that's what he does after the all star break.

Originally Posted by bodycheck

must just be me...

I dont know...Ive only seen like 8 games with the kid in it...but Schenn... seems to be pretty damn overrated...I mean

A) he is just a prospect...

B) he isnt really projected to be more than a solid, reliable centerman

C) he doesnt have the "gamebreaker" tag to him...

Yah, 5th overall pick... and really no reason to doubt he wont develop into a hell of a valuable player.

But man... seems like the kid is thought of as a GOD on the boards...

If I actually WANTED to make a deal for Kovalchuk... and this kid was a key component.. pffft... in a second...

Maybe just me... ive just read a lot of stuff lately where people are saying Schenn is going to be the guy who takes the Kings to the next level... I dont see it, in my limited exposure to his game... my uneducated view is, he ends up as a decent 2nd, 3rd liner with lots of PK time.

I see Doughty as an elite player we are blessed to have... thought he was a difference maker when i saw his minor league games...

Schenn, never really stood out in the 8 or so games ive seen him play.

OR Maybe he is the next Mike Richards and im completely clueless.

Or the next Rod Brind'Amour. I'm still not entirely sold on Lombardi, but one thing I respect him alot for is his ability to judge the character of a player. If he says the player has great character then he almost surely does. He says Schenn has great character and that's good enough for me. If that means he's the next Brind'Amour (a fantastically solid two-way 2nd line center who will never ever ever been thought of as a 1st line center), I'm ok with that and turning down a Kovalchuk type player to keep him.

Originally Posted by bodycheck

no.. not really..
The Kings trading for Kovalchuk as a rental THIS year is a horrible idea.

Unless there is a behind the scenes deal to lock him up for a REASONABLE contract.

Im not sure i even stand behind trading for a locked up Kovy if his contract is 9M +

I sort of disagree. If Kovalchuk is the right guy, this is the right year to acquire him. The question is whether he's the right guy...DL would have to give up an awful lot to get him whether as a rental or already signed, and that's a HUGE risk to take.

Originally Posted by USCKingsFan31

"Contender", sure. I just think it is an awfully tall order to expect a bunch of kids who have never played in a playoff game to run the postseason gauntlet and win it all.

We've spent all this time building up the makings of what is supposed to be a consistent playoff team for the foreseeable future; why put so much on the line THIS season?

Winning it all would be tremendously optimistic, but I could see them pull a Hawks and play in the Conference Finals. If you were DL and were convinced Quick was your guy...and you had to give up Bernier to get this team to the Conference Finals, would you do it? I would - that experience is SO valuable.

Originally Posted by capnking

Kovalchuk won't be nearly as expensive if he is unsigned or doesn't have an agreement in place with a team at the time of the trade. You really are looking at a rental player and there is no way we give up more then Frolov, our first, and one midlevel prospect like Moeller or Voinov. Heck there is a good chance Atlanta will settle for less then that. More like a first, second, and a midlevel prospect if they can't get a deal done. Also I think we would trade Quick before we trade Bernier. He is the future goaltender for the franchise.

First off, there is no chance that UFA Frolov is a key part of a deal for UFA Kovalchuk. That just makes ZERO sense from Atlanta's perspective.

Second, only the most optimistic GM would trade the bird in the hand (Quick) instead of the bird in the bush (Bernier). It's one thing to trade Huet when you have an untested Price because at least they'd seen Price under pressure and could judge him against Huet. But trading a guy who was a complete flop in his only test in the NHL would be a very bad idea.

Third, because of the cap, teams who can't acquire signed players can acquire UFAs, so I'm not so sure UFAs have less value than signed players. I don't think a blanket statement can be made either way.