December 7th, 2011, 02:51 PM #11
I'm from the old school of hockey. Back to when there were bench clearings, brawls that even went from the ice, up into the stands but, I also say it's time to take the fighting out of hockey. There are few anymore that are the result of actual tempers flaring over a play. Also, when a simple legal hit leads to a fight, it's getting rediculous. That and the staged fights are so obvious and uncalled for anymore. The game has changed and people just have got to accept that now for thrills, they get those damned shootouts (which I hate with a passion) They've improved the safety equipment, still working on better and better each day. For the sake of player safety, yes...remove the fighting.
December 7th, 2011, 04:04 PM #12
This will never be a safe sport. Fighting is a fundamental part of the game, and eliminating it all together is going to change the spirit of it. If 2 guys want to throw down, why not let them?
I just refuse to support the pussification of this sport.
December 7th, 2011, 09:30 PM #13
Here in lies the prob, even on legal checks the team is expected to respond. Agreed the staged fights need to go. Maybe to deter the retribution of fighting after a legal hit, tack on a misconduct and then suspension. Not saying this is the end all be all, but as mentioned earlier, the "NHL needs to man up and do something" about it.
Originally Posted by taz42
As far as an illegal hit, take away the instigator. Case in point today, Gerbe was boarded and Matte Ellis immediately went after Bourdon and the refs evened it up by giving Ellis an instigator, thus losing the powerplay.
December 7th, 2011, 09:42 PM #14
I'm really on the fence with this. Boogaard was one of my favorite non-Kings out there. To hear how much pain he was in and how much he craft got to him makes we wince every time I think of it.
I think it is for the players to decide, if they want to continue status quo, then so be it.
If the evidence becomes overwhelming though, they may need to be protected from themselves, but I haven't seen that yet.
How many 6'7" 300 pounders were skating around prior to only a few years back?
The game IS changing, the players are getting much bigger, stronger, faster and more skilled. . .
December 7th, 2011, 09:45 PM #15
I do not have a link, but I recall seeing on one of the major outlets (ESPN, TSN), that the players did not want to get rid of it.
Originally Posted by Noble Savage
December 7th, 2011, 09:48 PM #16
I'll partially agree with you, Taz. I hate this idea of "play date" fighting for no other reason than to have a fight. Fights 0:02 into the first period? Seriously? But I don't agree with the idea that all fighting should be banned or that enforcers have no place in the game. Eliminating fighting and enforcers will save a few people, but what about the other players who get concussions from legal hits and normal play? What about all the former NFL players suffering similar symptoms? They weren't enforcers or fighters; they were just going about their usual business. Dp we need to change all sports to try to eliminate any risk of concussion?
It sounds like there was a lot of enabling and looking the other way going on throughout Boogaard's career. His own personality sounds like he was prone to be impulsive and engage in risky behavior. So if not as a hockey enforcer, what other dangerous things might he have ended up doing? We know about the physical results, but what about the personality? Does a guy's personality (and lack of certain skills) draw him into that role and behavior? Or does the role help create that kind of behavior? I think the pain and the depression and the drug use and effects all feed off each other and create a cycle that in this case couldn't be broken.
All in all, it's a sad story. We can argue about it, but I'm not sure how preventable such long term injuries are in the future.
December 7th, 2011, 09:54 PM #17
This has become a classic misunremembering of hockey fans. There are hundreds of legal hits every night, rarely does a fight ensue. 30 years ago, it was no different. People fought for clean hits, they fought for dirty hits, they fought staged fights, et fricking cetera. Stop believing what some retired, oft-concussed player turned analyst has to say about "the good old days".
Originally Posted by taz42
As is always the case, the media takes on a cause and many mindlessly follow. Take a deep breath, give it more the 40 seconds after reading about a guy who died from an OD of alcohol and painkillers who also fought and think.
An to clarify things for the fans who complain that fights start after clean hits, allow me to take a second to explain something. The guys on the ice are not watching the game on TV. They do not watch 4 replays before deciding to act. You see your teammate down and you do something or you don't.
December 7th, 2011, 10:04 PM #18
Thats why i suggested getting rid of the instigator, maybe curbing some of the runs.
Originally Posted by gradin
I agree that the players do not have the replay etc... that we as fans have.
December 7th, 2011, 10:21 PM #19
I really do have very mixed emotions regarding all of this. In the past, if someone got run or got an illegal check, the players took care of their own. Now, with the refs stepping in, the penalties being called, the fines and suspensions, you can see how much things are changing in this sport and at a very fast pace. Myself, I always loved those tough guys and agitators, anyone remember Esa Tik.? that guy would stir up more crap and would yak like the devil out there in his native tongue and noone ever knew what the hell he was saying. Then there was Marty, next Avery, etc. Messier was no angel either. But, you can just see the changes each season (not that I like them or Bettman) but, you've got to recognize that Hockey will never be like it was. The big deal abt concussions going on, you can just see what's coming. Like it or not.
December 7th, 2011, 11:22 PM #20
I cannot remember the last time a fight changed the momentum/result of a game. If two guys get hot, then fine. But the enforcer has no role any longer. 'sparking' a team, 'standing up' for a teammate? Please. They only fight the other goons which doesn't seem to be a deterrent at all. Westgarth might be a big guy, capable(or not) of throwing big punches. But I for one do not really want to be there when he ends someone's carreer( or has his ended) in a meaningless brawl between two guys who play 5minutes a night if they are lucky.
Once upon a time the enforcer had a purpose, but no longer.