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  1. #521
    I get around




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    Quote Originally Posted by FlyBoeingJets View Post
    **** bonds.

    I'll be at the games tonight and tomorrow. Try and carry on here without me.

    Only if you make a promise to give us an "Orenko Chinko Swe" upon your return. Otherwise, you can't leave.

  2. #522
    FBJ
    FBJ is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Natural View Post
    Only if you make a promise to give us an "Orenko Chinko Swe" upon your return. Otherwise, you can't leave.
    If the situation calls for it, then it shall be.
    Anything worth shooting is worth shooting twice. Bullets are cheap. Life is priceless.


  3. #523
    EncinoDodgerFan
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbruin152 View Post
    Tell me honestly that you'd rather see him in the lineup than Kemp or Ethier. Really.
    It's not a matter of seeing him in the lineup rather than one of those guys. I'd like to see him in the lineup WITH those guys. I don't like our lineup as much without Furcal AND Pierre at the top. Gonzo has been a good player for us this year, and he's bridged the gap to the younger guys. I like the lineup the way it is right now, with everyone getting some time.

    Quote Originally Posted by jbruin152 View Post
    So basically... he sucks, but if we get good players to make him look like sucks less, we can stop worrying about his sucking?
    I didn't say he sucks, I said he has a below average arm. I think that weakness is amplified because Gonzo has a weak arm AND little range. Better arm and range in left takes some of the pressure off Pierre. But he certainly doesn't suck.

    Quote Originally Posted by jbruin152 View Post
    I guarantee you Juan Pierre will never look like a bargain at $9mil/year.
    I'm not so sure. With Ichio's extension and the money guys like Hunter, Jones, Rowand, etc. are sure to command this off season, $9 million for a CF will look pretty good. Especally on a 3-4 year deal if the Dodgers look to move him in the future. Heck, even a speedy leadoff guy like Furcal is going to get more than the $13 million or so next season that he's making now.

    Check these numbers out...

    Player 1
    .281 AVG
    .330 OBP
    .331 SLG
    178 HITS
    89 RUNS
    15 DOUBLES
    6 TRIPLES
    2 HOME RUNS
    38 RBI
    49 STEALS
    17 CAUGHT
    46 WALKS
    57 STRIKEOUTS

    Player 2
    .301 AVG
    .348 OBP
    .374 SLG
    200 HITS
    98 RUNS
    24 DOUBLES
    10 TRIPLES
    2 HOME RUNS
    46 RBI
    53 STEALS
    18 CAUGHT
    40 WALKS
    40 STRIKE OUTS
    Those are career 162-game averages for two different players. Pretty similar, huh? One of those players is a DODGER LEGEND. An Icon. A Hero! The other, Juan Pierre.

    I think Juan has a bum rap because he's not a stat machine. He changes the game in a different way and contributes more than most fans give him credit for.

  4. #524
    I don't rattle, kid. Kubrick's Avatar




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    Quote Originally Posted by EncinoDodgerFan View Post
    It's not a matter of seeing him in the lineup rather than one of those guys. I'd like to see him in the lineup WITH those guys. I don't like our lineup as much without Furcal AND Pierre at the top. Gonzo has been a good player for us this year, and he's bridged the gap to the younger guys. I like the lineup the way it is right now, with everyone getting some time.



    I didn't say he sucks, I said he has a below average arm. I think that weakness is amplified because Gonzo has a weak arm AND little range. Better arm and range in left takes some of the pressure off Pierre. But he certainly doesn't suck.



    I'm not so sure. With Ichio's extension and the money guys like Hunter, Jones, Rowand, etc. are sure to command this off season, $9 million for a CF will look pretty good. Especally on a 3-4 year deal if the Dodgers look to move him in the future. Heck, even a speedy leadoff guy like Furcal is going to get more than the $13 million or so next season that he's making now.

    Check these numbers out...



    Those are career 162-game averages for two different players. Pretty similar, huh? One of those players is a DODGER LEGEND. An Icon. A Hero! The other, Juan Pierre.

    I think Juan has a bum rap because he's not a stat machine. He changes the game in a different way and contributes more than most fans give him credit for.
    Is player 1 Brett Butler?

  5. #525
    Hoya
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    Quote Originally Posted by EncinoDodgerFan
    It's not a matter of seeing him in the lineup rather than one of those guys. I'd like to see him in the lineup WITH those guys. I don't like our lineup as much without Furcal AND Pierre at the top. Gonzo has been a good player for us this year, and he's bridged the gap to the younger guys. I like the lineup the way it is right now, with everyone getting some time.
    It absolutely IS him instead of those guys! He plays every single day (ugh) and takes a starting spot away from one of the two kids almost every game.

    There are three outfield spots. Pick your 3 out of Gonzo, Ethier, Kemp, and Pierre. There is no possible way you can tell me Pierre makes this team better than the other three.

    Quote Originally Posted by EncinoDodgerFan
    I didn't say he sucks, I said he has a below average arm. I think that weakness is amplified because Gonzo has a weak arm AND little range. Better arm and range in left takes some of the pressure off Pierre. But he certainly doesn't suck.
    I can put up with a weak arm in LF because you're almost never making a long range throw. 2nd base and 3rd base are within much shorter reach. And Gonzo makes up for it with his bat, and is on a one year deal.

    Pierre has decent range (but Kemp is faster and has a better arm), but his noodle arm is a joke.

    Quote Originally Posted by EncinoDodgerFan
    I think Juan has a bum rap because he's not a stat machine. He changes the game in a different way and contributes more than most fans give him credit for.
    Yes, he's fast. We get it. For a guy who's so renowned for his speed, he really doesn't get to utilize it very much. His OBP is pathetic, he only hits singles (ok, only 85% of the time), and he gets thrown out on the basepaths far too much.

    Again I ask, who of Gonzo, Ethier, and Kemp would you take out of the lineup? The correct answer is none of them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Die Radio Die
    Is player 1 Brett Butler?
    No, it's Maury Wills. Another incredibly overrated baseball player.

    His 104 SB year was amazing, yes, but he had very few actual productive years.
    Last edited by Hoya; July 19th, 2007 at 03:46 PM.

  6. #526
    EncinoDodgerFan
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbruin152 View Post
    No, it's Maury Wills. Another incredibly overrated baseball player.
    jbruin...this is the first thing you've ever said that actually made me sad.

    Oh...and of those four outfielders, I'll take Pierre, Kemp, and Ethier. In my ideal world, I'd use Gonzo as the veteran guy who needs to step back in a carry the load come playoff time if Kemp can't continue to close the hole in his strike zone.

  7. #527
    Hoya
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    Quote Originally Posted by EncinoDodgerFan
    jbruin...this is the first thing you've ever said that actually made me sad.
    The truth hurts. He had an amazing 1962. But an icon? Please.

    http://www.baseball-reference.com/w/willsma01.shtml

    Quote Originally Posted by EncinoDodgerFan
    Oh...and of those four outfielders, I'll take Pierre, Kemp, and Ethier. In my ideal world, I'd use Gonzo as the veteran guy who needs to step back in a carry the load come playoff time if Kemp can't continue to close the hole in his strike zone.
    This is the first thing you've said that made me sad.

    Gonzo has been so much better than Pierre this year--it's not even a comparison. Also, as noted, he's on a one-year deal, not a five-year deal where he continues to age and take the spot from a capable baseball player.

  8. #528
    Chipping for par lath19's Avatar




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    Meloan promoted to AAA. Would be nice if he could be MLB ready for the postseason.

  9. #529
    Chipping for par lath19's Avatar




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    Quote Originally Posted by EncinoDodgerFan View Post
    Oh...and of those four outfielders, I'll take Pierre, Kemp, and Ethier. In my ideal world, I'd use Gonzo as the veteran guy who needs to step back in a carry the load come playoff time if Kemp can't continue to close the hole in his strike zone.
    How can you possibly justify taking Pierre over Gonzo? The levels of offensive production aren't even close and they are both liabilities in the outfield. This is just crazy talk.

  10. #530
    I don't rattle, kid. Kubrick's Avatar




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    Quote Originally Posted by jbruin152 View Post
    No, it's Maury Wills. Another incredibly overrated baseball player.

    His 104 SB year was amazing, yes, but he had very few actual productive years.
    I miss Brett Butler.

    For some reason the one moment in his Dodger career that sticks out in my mind was back in '97, a year after he came back from tonsil cancer, he was playing LF and someone hit a line drive that he dove for and missed. I don't think he ever got up. As a matter of fact, if we were to drive up to Chavez Ravine today I'm positive we'd find ol' Brett still laying face down in the grass.



    Gone but not forget.

    Brett Butler
    6/15/1957 to ?/?/1997

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