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  1. #441
    Let the kids play ASUcruz's Avatar




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    http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/st...460660&cc=5901

    I'm guessing most 'Pool fans aren't too excited about this.

    I hate this international match days. It always seems like at least one United player comes back hurt.

  2. #442
    Good Times! redxalonso's Avatar




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    Again, show me where I said wining 2 La Liga's was a small feat. Valencia aren't Real Madrid or Barcelona but they are not Real Betis or anything. They are a big club. Benitez inherited some major league talent when he took over Valencia. Ayala, Baraja, Albeda, Canizares, I could be forgetting more. Vincente I'm sure. Let's not kid ourselves, Valencia was had plenty of star power. They weren't minnows or anything.

    Chelsea won 2 titles back to back under Mourinho. Not exactly an easy feat.

    Especially seeing as how the United team, Ferguson inherited was nearly RELEGATED. Yes, Man U were almost relegated. Now as mediocre as Liverpool were before Benetiz arrived, they were never in that dire of a situation. Liverpool were still big club. Obviously not a big spending one but with plenty of talent and some spending power.

    United were almost RELEGATED. I can't stress that point enough.


    When you say money to spend, what are you referring to. Clearly you are not comparing the spending ways of Man U back then to the spending ways of Man U now. Again two completley different situations.



    This old argument was awhile back. Show me when I looked passed these statistics to other problems. You mean problems like they were almost RELEGATED. Again two completely different situations.

    Ferguson still finished bottom half of the table after 3 seasons of rebuilding from that relegation squad. Keep coming with the excuses.

    After three seasons of rebuilding and a total of approx. 30 million pound spent on his current squad, Arsenal aren't regressing to the bottom half of the table now are they?

    After three seasons of rebuilding, Liverpool arent' going to finish in the bottom half of the table that's for sure.

    What I meant by United having money to spend, was in relative terms, he was not as cash strapped as Benitez's first three season with Liverpool. ManUtd were still making record signings then.

    Basically, if the EPL had a salary cap structure, Mourinho, Wenger, Benitez, Sam Allardyce and David Moyes are the ones who would come out ahead of Ferguson.

    Again, Mourinho took over a Chelsea team that was already being being built by Abramovich's money. A squad was good enough to finish second to that undefeated Arsenal team. Not exactly a Real Betis either.

    Hey everyone, I'm pathetic because I have a differing opinion!
    You're pathetic because Mourinho having a FAR MORE impressive resume is not a fact, but your opinion. The way you see Mourinho's resume is subjective, not an objective reality.

    Yes, I freely admit(never doubted really) that money plays a huge role in who wins the title. But Arsenal was just coming off a season where they were undefeated and Man U had a very powerful team as well. And Chelsea blew everyone out of the water. Money helps but it doens't alone build champions. Otherwise Ranieri would still be there
    At least we agree on the highlighted text.

    I NEVER underrated Mourinho, but the money he had to spend was unprecedented and you can't deny that.

    Damien Duff, SWP, and Drogba were all coveted by Liverpool before being priced out by Chelsea.

    Ranieri, on the other hand, was so bad that he was ridiculed by Valencia players for being clueless.

    Only an idiot would think that a team with Oshea, Sylvester, and Fletcher starting with Forlan, Bellion, Djemba2 on the bench is powerful. Tim Howard is a good GK but there's a reason why he's no longer with ManUtd.

  3. #443
    You'll Never Walk Alone chu gar's Avatar




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    Quote Originally Posted by ASUcruz View Post
    http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/st...460660&cc=5901

    I'm guessing most 'Pool fans aren't too excited about this.

    I hate this international match days. It always seems like at least one United player comes back hurt.
    I don't like it one bit. I'm all club.

  4. #444
    Good Times! redxalonso's Avatar




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    Quote Originally Posted by ASUcruz View Post
    And they got Morientes back in return. Yes he was cup tied but of course he could play in the league. You make it sound like once Cisse went down, Baros had to play 1000 games for Liverpool that year.
    For someone who confuses fact with opinion, let me help you out. Morientes did not arrive to Liverpool until the January transfer window.

    8 million plus Antonio Nunez was Liverpool's compensation for Owen you dip****. ManUtd still haven't replaced Ruud Van Nistlerooy.

    Baros did play a lot of games, at least you got something right. Before Neil Mellor was called up, Baros and Pongolle were Liverpool's best strikers available and Baros was the lone striker many times in a 4-5-1.

    Mellor and Pongolle are now playing for minnows.

    As for Morientes, See Crespo and Diego Forlan.

    ManUtd aren't scoring many goals without Rooney and Saha in the line up are they? Now you know why you're pathetic?

    Before I go on, I think it's pretty obvious that a small club from Porto suffers much, much more than a big club like Liverpool when players are out. You say Liverpool have no depth, I tend to agree as they did have a lot of **** players back then. But the overall squad still had many internationals on the bench. Smicer a Czech international for example. Porto loses guys and they don't have any internationals on the bench.
    Basically you get the idea. Porto are a small club, winning a Champions League with that type of team is impressive. In my eyes more impressive than a title run with Liverpool Who despite the injuries still had plenty of talent on the pitch
    Liverpool are seen as a big club based on the money spent, I can't disagree with that. But the reason why Houllier's era ended was because the quality didn't match the 125 million he spent. Liverpool at the end of Houllier's era and beginning of Benitez's reign were only a big club by name.

    Fact is, we had trouble beating minnows.

    Smicer retired the year after we won the CL. Compared to the decent player in 1996 Euro, he was washed up in 2005...simple as that.

    Djimi Traore, Igor Biscan, Pongolle, Anthony La Tallec, Neil Mellor, Darren Potter, David Raven, Chris Kirkland, Dudek, Salif Diao, Antonio Nunez, Josemi.

    Those are players Benitez had to pick from Liverpool's depth. They may have had potential, like all young players, but Liverpool had a **** load of them that didnt' pan out. Baros and Cisse included.

    Mourinho had half a season to evaluate his team, and an off season to field the player he wanted. Rate the Portugese players however you want, fact is Porto had a few national team members, and Portugal have performed consistently in international tournaments so Mourinho's players are not exaclty chumps.

    This is a funny point. The real reason why Chelsea haven't made the CL finals is because of Benitez? Oh I didn't know Benitez played for Barcelona in 2005-06. This just a good example of the perpetual handjob giving to Benitez by Liverpool fans.
    Fair point. That was my mistake.

    It still doesn't make you less pathetic for thinking Mourinho's resume is FAR BETTER than Benitez.

    As for the perpetual hand job thing, you're being a hypocrite again.
    Last edited by redxalonso; September 6th, 2007 at 01:05 AM.

  5. #445
    Good Times! redxalonso's Avatar




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    Quote Originally Posted by chu gar View Post
    I don't like it one bit. I'm all club.
    In the long run, this is more of a concern.

    Liverpool's proposed debts may spark alarm
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/mai...106.xml&page=2

  6. #446
    SepticFish's Avatar




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    Quote Originally Posted by ASUcruz View Post
    I hate this international match days. It always seems like at least one United player comes back hurt.
    You mean like this. http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/foot...ls/6980923.stm

  7. #447
    Let the kids play ASUcruz's Avatar




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    Quote Originally Posted by chu gar View Post
    I don't like it one bit. I'm all club.
    Yea, seeing as how we're not English that goes without saying.

    If I were an Englishman I'd probably feel different.

  8. #448
    Let the kids play ASUcruz's Avatar




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    Quote Originally Posted by redxalonso View Post
    Ferguson still finished bottom half of the table after 3 seasons of rebuilding from that relegation squad. Keep coming with the excuses.
    I'm not sure you get my point. Ferguson took over a team that was nearly relegated. None of the other clubs you mentioned below had to deal with that. That point is pretty clear, I'm not sure how it's an excuse, seems like a pretty important fact.
    Quote Originally Posted by redxalonso
    After three seasons of rebuilding and a total of approx. 30 million pound spent on his current squad, Arsenal aren't regressing to the bottom half of the table now are they?
    Again, Wegner wasn't rebuilding a club that was nearly relegated. They were still at top 4 club.

    Quote Originally Posted by redxalonso
    After three seasons of rebuilding, Liverpool arent' going to finish in the bottom half of the table that's for sure.
    Again, Benetiz wasn't rebuilding a team that was nearly relegated. Again a top 4 club.

    You don't seem to understand that simple fact. Your comparisons are invalid because they are completely different situations.
    Quote Originally Posted by redxalonso
    Basically, if the EPL had a salary cap structure, Mourinho, Wenger, Benitez, Sam Allardyce and David Moyes are the ones who would come out ahead of Ferguson.
    Seeing as Ferguson was able to win a European Cup with a very small club in Aberdeen I think this point is very arguable.

    Quote Originally Posted by redxalonso
    You're pathetic because Mourinho having a FAR MORE impressive resume is not a fact, but your opinion. The way you see Mourinho's resume is subjective, not an objective reality.
    So your saying I'm pathetic because I have an opinion. Next time I'll preface all my comments with "In my opinion" since you aren't able to understand what is or isn't.

    Quote Originally Posted by redxalonso
    Only an idiot would think that a team with Oshea, Sylvester, and Fletcher starting with Forlan, Bellion, Djemba2 on the bench is powerful. Tim Howard is a good GK but there's a reason why he's no longer with ManUtd.
    This is another thing I noticed in this discussions. Redxalonso has the tendency to take one of my sound arguments. Misconstrue in completely and then argue against it.

    Let's look at my quote

    Quote Originally Posted by ASUcruz
    Chelsea won 2 titles back to back under Mourinho. Not exactly an easy feat. Yes, I freely admit(never doubted really) that money plays a huge role in who wins the title. But Arsenal was just coming off a season where they were undefeated and Man U had a very powerful team as well. And Chelsea blew everyone out of the water. Money helps but it doens't alone build champions. Otherwise Ranieri would still be there.
    If you would read this point clearly, you would understand that the point I am making was that wining 2 back to back titles with Chelsea was a very impressive feat because the top teams in the Premiership were very strong. Notice I wrote "2 back to back title". No mention of the Champions League whatsoever. The point was made to illustrate that winning two titles back to back against such top competition is not an easy feat.

    Yet, Redxalonso somehow takes this point and attributes it to someting completley different.

    First he gives me the old personal insult then takes a lineup against Porto and wonders why I would call this team powerful. Apparently one squad determines whether or not a team is powerful or not.

    Seeing that United were a year removed from winning the title I think that team was powerful. Keane, Scholes, Giggs, Ruud, Rio, and Neville as the established players. An up and comer in Ronaldo, as well as good squad players like Ole, Brown, and Butt.

    That was still a very good squad. Make fun of Silvestre all you want, I sure do, but he did put in a few good seasons for United amidst all his average ones.

  9. #449
    Let the kids play ASUcruz's Avatar




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    Quote Originally Posted by SepticFish View Post
    Sort of, seems like our guys(and I'm sure everyone else's) end up getting hurt in the game. This is actually good news, hopefully Hargreaves doesn't play and he gets the entire week off.

    Crucial couple games for United @Everton and home against Chelsea.

  10. #450
    Let the kids play ASUcruz's Avatar




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    This is a great headline

    "Heskey raring to go"

    http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/st...460853&cc=5901

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