The evolution of a (semi) flat roof solar install....An EPIC mini series!

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Originally Posted by KRC1221

Easy tiger. I'm just giving you a hard time. Hence the wink. Moving on.

Its like leasing a car. Down payment and then a monthly payment which will be less than your monthly electricity bill. So the upfront cost is not that bad. This is all assuming that the client has a very good credit score.

I commend you and you being off grid. I'd love to see some pics. Did the city make you jump through many hoops and drag you through the mud when trying to get it commissioned?

And yes i am a smartass and i take pride in it. Don't take offense to it b/c none was intended.

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no dude. I built a place out in the middle of no where Idaho, and upgraded my place in Bear Valley Springs, Ca. No hoops.

We went state of the art, (at the time 7 yrs ago) with the solar/wind system in Idaho. up graded in Tehachapi a little over a year ago.

I just am lucky, I don't have to deal with a lot of government agencies. where my homes are, make perfect sense for solar and wind. we do back up with automatic generators in case of snow cover. Propane systems.
We heat with state of the art wood systems. It cost a lot to set up, but my heating/cooling, ( no A/C), we don't need it, is less than 1k per year.

Dude, you drilled HOW MANY HOLES IN THAT ROOF? I can care less about how cool the sealant is, its gonna leak.

I've done the numbers, you don't lease the solar system, its not worth doing unless you buy it. Your return on what you sell back to the power company aren't going to be there month in month out, especially when you don't want to climb up there to clean it once a week.

As for X-Wing, he may talk the game of being Mr. Tech Worthless, but that cowboy knows a helluva lot more about cutting edge stuff than you think. When the big one hits, and LA turns into Mad Max, I'm throwing everyone in the RV and heading to his place in Idaho.

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Originally Posted by Birdman:2378174

Dude, you drilled HOW MANY HOLES IN THAT ROOF? I can care less about how cool the sealant is, its gonna leak.

I've done the numbers, you don't lease the solar system, its not worth doing unless you buy it. Your return on what you sell back to the power company aren't going to be there month in month out, especially when you don't want to climb up there to clean it once a week.

As for X-Wing, he may talk the game of being Mr. Tech Worthless, but that cowboy knows a helluva lot more about cutting edge stuff than you think. When the big one hits, and LA turns into Mad Max, I'm throwing everyone in the RV and heading to his place in Idaho.

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Funny, no job we've done in LA as a company has leaked at all in the 10 months I've been there. So we're obviously doing it right.

You don't sell anything back to the utility. There is no feed in tariff in the U.S. Your meter spins backwards during the day if you're not home. At night when the panels aren't producing you're pulling from the utility.

Well our business model is working very well. It allows people who don't have 20k burning a hole in their pocket to get solar. And they're paying less than their SCE or LADWP bill.

If you want to get into simple payback and internal rate of return thats a totally different discussion.

You guys have been knocking at my door 4 times a month, what gives?
What happens if I want to sell my house and the system is there? And the next owner wants it off? Then there is a ton of holes in the roof

I rent, so:

:popcorn:

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Originally Posted by KRC1221

Funny, no job we've done in LA as a company has leaked at all in the 10 months I've been there. So we're obviously doing it right.

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Give it 2 years, and then lets talk about the leaking roof thing.

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Originally Posted by KRC1221

You don't sell anything back to the utility. There is no feed in tariff in the U.S. Your meter spins backwards during the day if you're not home. At night when the panels aren't producing you're pulling from the utility.

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Why aren't you getting paid by the utility? Need a different panel/feeder set?

The neighbor next door is the Solar dude I know. Half his system heats his pool, the other half generates juice for his house and "supposedly" supplies the utility. He put in some fancy new panel that has dual feeders.

mine are mounted on ground platforms, but then, I have a much larger back yard than most of you. I did it that way for two reasons. the amount of panels to run my place, and easy access to clear snow and dust kicked up by the horses.

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Originally Posted by tom91381

You guys have been knocking at my door 4 times a month, what gives?
What happens if I want to sell my house and the system is there? And the next owner wants it off? Then there is a ton of holes in the roof

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I wasn't aware that our sales people were going door to door.

I can't really imagine why a person wouldn't want the free energy but who knows. You are able to add the cost of the system into the sale price of the house. I don't know who would be responsible for the cost of the system coming off the house. If it was a comp shingle roof it would be pretty easy to flash it. But I don't know who would be responsible for any potential leaks. B/c we aren't in business to removing solar systems. You know?

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Originally Posted by Birdman

Give it 2 years, and then lets talk about the leaking roof thing.



Why aren't you getting paid by the utility? Need a different panel/feeder set?

The neighbor next door is the Solar dude I know. Half his system heats his pool, the other half generates juice for his house and "supposedly" supplies the utility. He put in some fancy new panel that has dual feeders.

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Honestly, you don't know all the lengths we go to make a roof water tight. There are several different processes that we do for each roof style to make it water tight. I'm not saying that it isn't possible but it is very unlikely. If the roof isn't in good shape, we won't even touch it. But, if a re roof of some sort is necessary it can also be worked into the lease agreement. I've done a jobs on pretty much all types of roofs excluding shake roofs. The most difficult was an exposed rafter roof. And even the penetrations that missed the rafters have yet to leak. I'd honestly say that 95% of the roofs we do don't have leaks. We, the installers, go back and fix leaks if they happen. And in my 10 months there I have never heard of a crew having to go back to fix a leak.

This is a rather large company w/ a good amount of money behind it. If we didn't flash roofs properly word would get out and our business would suffer. All that money behind the company allows us to get the highest quality products available.

Anyway, moving on.

You might get a MINIMAL amount of money back from the utility. But its so little money that it would be pointless to oversize the system for more juice than your house would use. When the sun is out during the day and the modules are producing you are sending power back to the utility, not selling it to them. And then you pull power when you get home and go about your business. The goal is basically to have balance out what you produce and what you use.

Countries like Spain, Portugal and Germany do have feed in tariffs where it would benefit you to oversize your system.

Lastly, pools really are the devil when it comes to electricity usage. They will bleed you dry.

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d1...2-04_729-1.jpg

Ok boys and well....boys, a few new pics. Our equipment is under the house in the "crawl space." Plenty of room to move around. You will see, from left to right, the sub panel (we didn't install), the DC Disconnect (door is open), the two Fronius inverters and lastly the load center. The wire pull from the main panel and other disconnect was probably 175-200' and went relatively smooth considering the multiple pull points we had to work around.

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d1...08-50_1091.jpg

Here is the south array with the modules locked down in their final spot. There is a total of 14 modules wired together in series (positive to negative, positive to negative etc...). If you connect them in series the voltage adds and amps stay the same. If you connect them in parallel amps add and voltage stays the same.

The final product tomorrow.....stay tuned!