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  1. #11
    Time wounds all heels.
    Stormy2213's Avatar
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    Sounds like sour grapes to me. You win 3 out of 5 WS titles and you're a good team, period.

  2. #12
    Good Times!
    redxalonso's Avatar
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    Great scouting, homegrown core players, and acquiring character players via trade of free agent, great coaching

    Sound familiar?

  3. #13
    2nd Scoring Line
    KingsFan1985's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stormy2213 View Post
    Sounds like sour grapes to me. You win 3 out of 5 WS titles and you're a good team, period.
    Who said they were a bad team? The question is are they the worst dynasty team of all time. Dynasty teams tend to be pretty good.


    Quote Originally Posted by redxalonso View Post
    Great scouting, homegrown core players, and acquiring character players via trade of free agent, great coaching

    Sound familiar?
    Agree with that. One difference between the Kings and Giants though is that the Kings tend to be advanced stats darlings, while the Giants are not even the best sabermeteric team within a 20 mile radius of their own ballpark. Yes the Giants have their core players (I wouldn't say as many as the Kings), but a large part of their three championships have come off the backs of washed up or journey men players they picked up before the trade deadline. And before you people bring up Penner and Gabo the ratio of these types of players on the Kings compared to the Giants is nowhere near as close to one another. Giants seem to defy not only the sabermetric community, but also the traditional baseball community.

  4. #14
    Bring on Vancouver!
    USCKingsFan31's Avatar
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    "If you're gonna compare a Hanzo sword, you compare it to every other sword ever made... that wasn't made by Hattori Hanzo."

    If you're gonna compare a dynasty, you compare it to every other team that isn't one.

  5. #15
    2nd Scoring Line
    KingsFan1985's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by USCKingsFan31 View Post
    "If you're gonna compare a Hanzo sword, you compare it to every other sword ever made... that wasn't made by Hattori Hanzo."

    If you're gonna compare a dynasty, you compare it to every other team that isn't one.
    How about this one!

    The Willie Mays era SF Giants that produced multiple hall of famers but won no champions vs. the current dynasty SF Giants that won two of their three championships relying heavily on players like Juan Uribe, Marco Scutaro, and Cody Ross.

  6. #16
    Good Times!
    redxalonso's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KingsFan1985 View Post
    Who said they were a bad team? The question is are they the worst dynasty team of all time. Dynasty teams tend to be pretty good.




    Agree with that. One difference between the Kings and Giants though is that the Kings tend to be advanced stats darlings, while the Giants are not even the best sabermeteric team within a 20 mile radius of their own ballpark. Yes the Giants have their core players (I wouldn't say as many as the Kings), but a large part of their three championships have come off the backs of washed up or journey men players they picked up before the trade deadline. And before you people bring up Penner and Gabo the ratio of these types of players on the Kings compared to the Giants is nowhere near as close to one another. Giants seem to defy not only the sabermetric community, but also the traditional baseball community.
    What about the pitching and defense, the two most important factors in winning WS titles.

    2010 Giants pitching were sick. in the PO's, Cain, Lincecum and Bum went 6-1 sub 2.0 era, and Brian Wilson shut the door in RS and PO. With all due respect to Ross, Huff, and Burrell, the Giants wouldn't have won without the pitching and a decent enough defense.

    2012. While the pitching staff regressed, the defense got even better, and the bats woke up in the POs. Crawford, Scutaro and Pagan up the middle. Panda and Belt in the corners. Pence and whomever in left and right. Buster wins NL MVP, Kung Fu Panda awakens in the playoffs, especially against Verlander. Pagan and Scutaro were also huge in the PO, and I wouldn't consider them washed up. Lincecum had already lost his mojo but still shut it down as a middle reliever. Romo became Giants closer and shut the door. IMO, in terms of balanced contribution, this was the Giant's best title winning team and only two players, Vogelsong and Zito, were washed up.

    2014. Cain and Scutaro goes down, Giants get Peavy and calls up Panik, Susac, and Duffy. Of the three, Panik made a name for himself, if not in the RS, the definitely in the playoffs. Those rookie call ups show serious organizational depth. Of the bullpen core four, 3 of whom were home grown and were lights out. Hunter Pence, who is not a journeyman nor is he washed up, was great in the POs. Kung Fu Panda 2. Peavy and Hudson get rocked but Madison Bumgarner saves the day. The rotation isn't even good without Bumgarner but the defense is still one of the best in the majors, especially the infield with Panik.

    That's a lot of contributions from many of the Giants homegrown players.

  7. #17
    2nd Scoring Line
    KingsFan1985's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by redxalonso View Post
    What about the pitching and defense, the two most important factors in winning WS titles.

    2010 Giants pitching were sick. in the PO's, Cain, Lincecum and Bum went 6-1 sub 2.0 era, and Brian Wilson shut the door in RS and PO. With all due respect to Ross, Huff, and Burrell, the Giants wouldn't have won without the pitching and a decent enough defense.

    2012. While the pitching staff regressed, the defense got even better, and the bats woke up in the POs. Crawford, Scutaro and Pagan up the middle. Panda and Belt in the corners. Pence and whomever in left and right. Buster wins NL MVP, Kung Fu Panda awakens in the playoffs, especially against Verlander. Pagan and Scutaro were also huge in the PO, and I wouldn't consider them washed up. Lincecum had already lost his mojo but still shut it down as a middle reliever. Romo became Giants closer and shut the door. IMO, in terms of balanced contribution, this was the Giant's best title winning team and only two players, Vogelsong and Zito, were washed up.

    2014. Cain and Scutaro goes down, Giants get Peavy and calls up Panik, Susac, and Duffy. Of the three, Panik made a name for himself, if not in the RS, the definitely in the playoffs. Those rookie call ups show serious organizational depth. Of the bullpen core four, 3 of whom were home grown and were lights out. Hunter Pence, who is not a journeyman nor is he washed up, was great in the POs. Kung Fu Panda 2. Peavy and Hudson get rocked but Madison Bumgarner saves the day. The rotation isn't even good without Bumgarner but the defense is still one of the best in the majors, especially the infield with Panik.

    That's a lot of contributions from many of the Giants homegrown players.
    Well I think this going to go around in circles. Like I said I agree about the pitching and defense back in 2010, not going to hear my complain against that. I do feel you are kind of underplaying the importance non core Giants players had to contributing to the 3 championships.

    I'll just leave it on this note, and I think putting it in this context might help me make my point. While it feels great to have 3 championships no matter how you get it, at the same time though doesn't it feel a little unjust that those Willie Mays teams of the 1960's got no rings simply because of the playoff system that existed back them, but this team got one thanks in large part to a watered down playoff system where almost half the league gets in now?

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