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Thread: The Kneeling Phenomena (during National Anthem)

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mondo Blando View Post
    You answered your own question. Protesting is the ultimate act of expressing one's freedom.

    Don't lose that in the fervor.
    It's not hard to understand that protesting against the country that protects that right is inherently conflicted. That sir, is why they're morons. There are plenty of correct ways to go about this where they won't look like childish *******s, but this isn't one of them.

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    All I have to say is I find it premature (and slightly humorous) that I saw lots of memes on Facebook yesterday saying, "You won't see hockey players do this". And here I'm thinking, "Don't be so sure. The season is right around the corner."

    Then again, most players are Canadian so I'm sure they couldn't give two ****s about what's going on. But we'll have to wait and see.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pretty Vivid View Post
    Hive minded tribalistic morons who don't have the spine to acknowledge that the numbers prove their narrative is a lie.
    I have no doubt that the incredible irony of that statement escapes you.

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    While I acknowledge their right to do this, I still think it's bad form. It's disrespectful to literally millions of US citizens that sacrificed their lives so that we can have the incredible country that we have.

    But Trump wasted no time in unnecessarily blowing the issue up into the news cycle monster it has become.

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    At the time, Americans thought the 1963 March on Washington was in "bad form." Many Americans regularly called MLK and Rosa Parks communists and traitors. The majority of Americans thought the civil rights movement of the 60s would hurt the cause of equality. None of these protests were convenient or easy. They upset the majority of American people.

    These players are not protesting the flag or the anthem any more than Rosa Parks was protesting a bus. You might say do it in some other fashion, at some other time; but you cannot deny it has been amazingly effective in that we are all talking about it, and that at least is part of the goal. You obviously have every right to disagree with them. I would say however, the lens of history has radically changed public opinion of the civil rights protests of the 60s. In forty, fifty, sixty years, which side of that equation do you want to be on? Peaceful exercise of free speech seeking redress for unfair policing policy doesn't seem a bad thing.

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    When are protests ever "proper," or "convenient" or "respectful?? If they are they are mostly worthless - the whole point of a protest is to make people uncomfortable. Was throwing tea into Boston Harbor "proper" or "respectful"? Slaves running away from their masters was not "proper." Breaking the law by not sitting at the back of the bus, or sitting at a "whites only" lunch counter was "improper." People broke the law by marrying people of other races until pretty recently.

    Why is there a ****ing anthem at the game in the first place? What does it have to do with a game of football, especially a game between two U.S. teams? We're used to it, but NOBODY else on the planet does this ****. The same for all the general flag waiving and the paid-for "Salute to Service." This is NOT normal by any stretch of the imagination. It's weird. It's Orwellian. It's creepy as hell, and it doesn't even dawn on anyone to question it. I find patriotism being stuffed down my throat at every sporting event I watch on TV or attend in person offensive as hell. I was born in a country with a totalitarian regime and they did that (and even they didn't play the anthem at games) and the differences between that country and this country are getting harder to see on a daily basis. It's terrifying.

    From Martin Luther King's "Letter from a Birmingham Jail," written in 1963. The more things change...

    “I must make two honest confessions to you, my Christian and Jewish brothers. First, I must confess that over the past few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Counciler or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says: "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I cannot agree with your methods of direct action"; who paternalistically believes he can set the timetable for another man's freedom; who lives by a mythical concept of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait for a "more convenient season." Shallow understanding from people of good will is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. Lukewarm acceptance is much more bewildering than outright rejection.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by santiclaws View Post
    When are protests ever "proper," or "convenient" or "respectful?? If they are they are mostly worthless - the whole point of a protest is to make people uncomfortable. Was throwing tea into Boston Harbor "proper" or "respectful"? Slaves running away from their masters was not "proper." Breaking the law by not sitting at the back of the bus, or sitting at a "whites only" lunch counter was "improper." People broke the law by marrying people of other races until pretty recently.

    From Martin Luther King's "Letter from a Birmingham Jail," written in 1963. The more things change...

    “I must make two honest confessions to you, my Christian and Jewish brothers. First, I must confess that over the past few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Counciler or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says: "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I cannot agree with your methods of direct action"; who paternalistically believes he can set the timetable for another man's freedom; who lives by a mythical concept of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait for a "more convenient season." Shallow understanding from people of good will is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. Lukewarm acceptance is much more bewildering than outright rejection.”
    Apples and hubcaps. Certainly you see the inconsistencies in your analogies. This kneeling thing is a lazy, inarticulate temper tantrum, with all the maturity of holding one's breath. Don't draw parallels to truly courageous heroes like Parks and King who contested real issues; it's an insult to them and it implies you don't know better.

    This isn't a matter of proper versus improper, uncomfortable, inappropriate, whatever. It's a matter of disrespecting the entire nation, everybody in it, everybody who fought and died for it, and everything it stands for. And when it's that very nation that pioneered the freedoms they enjoy, the one led the world in that direction, it's simply moronic. Then there's the "hiding in the locker room" thing. Sheer cowardice.

    In summary: it's a disrespectful act by unashamedly uneducated, ungrateful, moronic cowards. There isn't one noble or heroic thing about this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by salami View Post
    Apples and hubcaps. Certainly you see the inconsistencies in your analogies. This kneeling thing is a lazy, inarticulate temper tantrum, with all the maturity of holding one's breath. Don't draw parallels to truly courageous heroes like Parks and King who contested real issues; it's an insult to them and it implies you don't know better.
    Taking a knee is not an "inarticulate temper tantrum." It is not disrespectful to everyone in the country; it does not affect you or anyone else in any way. It is a song, and it is a piece of cloth. No one has ever fought or died for either. People die for their family, and their friends and their neighbors. They died for our rights, including our right to protest perceived injustice. And the fact that the justice system in this country is heavily stacked against black people, including police officers shooting them at a much higher rate than whites, just may seem like "real issues" to black people.

    The tactic of trying to co-opt people who "fought and died for" the nation, without their knowledge or consent, onto your side of the argument is old, tired and very transparent. "It dishonors the memory of countless thousands of our dead who offered up their very lives in defense of principles which this bill destroys." George Wallace, the governor of Alabama, on the subject of the Civil Rights Bill in 1964.

    And calling everyone who disagrees with you "uneducated, ungrateful, moronic cowards" says far more about you than about the people you seek to slander. When your "argument" consists of name-calling, it suggests you have no rational argument and know that you have no chance of convincing anyone of anything by appealing to their intellect. It's the Donald Trump school of oration.

    You should find this guy and tell him that he's an uneducated, ungrateful, moronic coward.

    Last edited by santiclaws; September 26th, 2017 at 11:25 PM.

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    It's interesting for those that are so offended calling people names throwing stones, who are you to say how one can silently protest peacefully? I don't understand how people get so hung up on the flag it's just a piece of material what it represents is freedom and freedom of expression.

    To the out of context patriots, How can you possibly say they're protesting the country? They're protesting what's going on in their own communities.

    I just read an article today with Joel Ward of the San Jose Sharks saying he understands the situation, and might show solidarity too, because he has also been on the hurtful side of racism even as a rich professional athlete, stemming back to his youth. Even though he's Canadian he still feels the injustice. So just because you're not being persecuted doesn't mean nobody else is so show a little empathy rather than judgement.

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    As for calling taking a knee "inarticulate" and a "temper tantrum" Jesus you swear like they're running around the field, screaming f the police, punting balls into the crowd during the anthem to show Defiance-- Hyperbole much?

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