Hiller Hotseat Thread

[MiketheKing]

This does look dire.

One thing to point out:
No way he could keep all of the mentioned (Faber, Durzi, Walker, Roy) - at least one of them would have to go regardless, as there was Doughty, and only one of them could play LD (and wasn't that great at it) and it's questionable how well Durzi would develop had he played 10 min/game instead of 20. And Spence never gets a chance and he likely joins the list of would've-beens that didn't get traded for a return (Kaliyev, JAD, Thomas, Bjornfot, Turcotte, and Kupari, that Clif noted). Clarke doesn't get drafted either, but it's entirely possible that someone like Sillinger gets drafted instead to fill the center need in the prospect pipeline.

Now that I think about it...drafting Stützle might've caused Sturm to be hired instead of Hiller, too, who knows...

But in this scenario the Kings might end up with sub-par goaltending that doesn't get them any farther than they got anyways. It's true though that the future would look brighter.

Stutzle was a sure fire scorer, while we got caught hoping QB would fill the huge shoes of AK and it doesn't look like it's happening anytime soon. I like QB, but he's far from being the face of any franchise.

 

[Bollocks]

Let’s be real. The Kings drafted QB because he has the right skin color for Los Angeles. Kings marketing and ‘woke’ HR want to be inclusive and also try to sell the game to the POC in the LA sports market. They don’t understand that ice hockey won’t ever be as big as basketball, baseball or football in LA because it’s a very expensive sport and can’t be played in any LA neighborhood, especially in the summer.

That's very far from an issue that would be exclusive to LA, though.

Let's be real. You're irked about LA drafting QB and blame it on "wokeism" because you don't know better.

Let me tell you: Rob believed QB could be as good as Kopitar. End of story.

So far he's far from Kopitar, he's unlikely to ever reach that level, but don't make it sound like this is something that is not. Nobody cares about skin color with #2 overall pick, there's too much at stake. Be serious.

 

[Halfwall]

That's very far from an issue that would be exclusive to LA, though.

Let's be real. You're irked about LA drafting QB and blame it on "wokeism" because you don't know better.

Let me tell you: Rob believed QB could be as good as Kopitar. End of story.

So far he's far from Kopitar, he's unlikely to ever reach that level, but don't make it sound like this is something that is not. Nobody cares about skin color with #2 overall pick, there's too much at stake. Be serious.

He got paid to believe it.

 

[Clif]

That's very far from an issue that would be exclusive to LA, though.

Let's be real. You're irked about LA drafting QB and blame it on "wokeism" because you don't know better.

Let me tell you: Rob believed QB could be as good as Kopitar. End of story.

So far he's far from Kopitar, he's unlikely to ever reach that level, but don't make it sound like this is something that is not. Nobody cares about skin color with #2 overall pick, there's too much at stake. Be serious.

Thank you. What an absurd and unserious post from @King of Pentacle5. Byfield was ranked ahead of Stutzle at number 2 in multiple final draft rankings, might we all remember. This Stutzle revisionism is acting like the Kings made a reach pick by not taking the consensus third over the consensus second prospect.

afterall, NYR still took the consensus number one prospect in that draft. What were they thinking? :/sarcasm font

 

[emsomaso]

Thank you. What an absurd and unserious post from @King of Pentacle5. Byfield was ranked ahead of Stutzle at number 2 in multiple final draft rankings, might we all remember. This Stutzle revisionism is acting like the Kings made a reach pick by not taking the consensus third over the consensus second prospect.

afterall, NYR still took the consensus number one prospect in that draft. What were they thinking? :/sarcasm font

Coming here and talking sense, what’s that about?

 

[xcheck]

It’s a fine memory. But that is all it should be. Time to move ahead instead.

Not that Sutter. This Sutter

 

[MiketheKing]

That's very far from an issue that would be exclusive to LA, though.

Let's be real. You're irked about LA drafting QB and blame it on "wokeism" because you don't know better.

Let me tell you: Rob believed QB could be as good as Kopitar. End of story.

So far he's far from Kopitar, he's unlikely to ever reach that level, but don't make it sound like this is something that is not. Nobody cares about skin color with #2 overall pick, there's too much at stake. Be serious.

Fact is centers are more valuable than wingers. We drafted based on value and potential, not pure skill

 

[DryKing]

Thank you. What an absurd and unserious post from @King of Pentacle5. Byfield was ranked ahead of Stutzle at number 2 in multiple final draft rankings, might we all remember. This Stutzle revisionism is acting like the Kings made a reach pick by not taking the consensus third over the consensus second prospect.

afterall, NYR still took the consensus number one prospect in that draft. What were they thinking? :/sarcasm font

There was even talk entering the draft that NYR may choose to draft Byfield over Lafreneire at #1 (a few sources stating they were considering doing so).

Most believed Stutlze would be good, but it was a surprise to most just how good he has turned out to be. His relentless effort to improve and ability to build the defensive side of his game really catapulted him forward after joining the league.

 

[Illegal_Stick]

After all these years and all that happened since that retool vs. rebuild, do you really, really think rookie GM Rob had free reign to decide as he wishes on that matter? Come on.

I stand by what I said multiple times - him hiring Willie-D was IMO an intentional team sabotage in order to squeeze a green light for a retool from the upper management.

I mean it was said he overruled the scouts on the Byfield pick - so that’s free regin no? I think he has free rein because who else would’ve been making those decisions? Luc?

This does look dire.

One thing to point out:
No way he could keep all of the mentioned (Faber, Durzi, Walker, Roy) - at least one of them would have to go regardless, as there was Doughty, and only one of them could play LD (and wasn't that great at it) and it's questionable how well Durzi would develop had he played 10 min/game instead of 20. And Spence never gets a chance and he likely joins the list of would've-beens that didn't get traded for a return (Kaliyev, JAD, Thomas, Bjornfot, Turcotte, and Kupari, that Clif noted). Clarke doesn't get drafted either, but it's entirely possible that someone like Sillinger gets drafted instead to fill the center need in the prospect pipeline.

Now that I think about it...drafting Stützle might've caused Sturm to be hired instead of Hiller, too, who knows...

But in this scenario the Kings might end up with sub-par goaltending that doesn't get them any farther than they got anyways. It's true though that the future would look brighter.

definitely could not have kept them all. The reality is likely that if they hadn’t traded Faber for Fiala he may have been gone with the rest of them for a draft pick

 

[Illegal_Stick]

Ugh… wouldn’t have brought up Byfield/Stutzle if I thought “wokeness” would be atupidly brought up.

To be clear, I think they chose wrong. The scouts wanted Stutzle. Blake obviously believed he was going to be better. He was wrong.

Frankly, to argue against myself - Stutzle should’ve went first anyway and we would’ve been stuck with Lafrenière.

Rob Blake and the scouts always did what they thought was best for the team - they wanted to win badly. They just made key mistakes that derailed the retool, in my opinion.

 

[Dexter]

 

[emsomaso]

What is Holland expected to say? It’s not like he will say that he’s thinking about fire him but haven’t really decided yet…

The best thing about the trade may be the opportunity for Turcotte to prove himself!

 

[VCRW]

So… if Turc and Sami take over 3C and 4C, I guess that means Holland will be pursuing a scoring winger this season with the added cap space. Tuch! Tuch! Tuch!

 

[Bollocks]

I mean it was said he overruled the scouts on the Byfield pick - so that’s free regin no? I think he has free rein because who else would’ve been making those decisions? Luc?

definitely could not have kept them all. The reality is likely that if they hadn’t traded Faber for Fiala he may have been gone with the rest of them for a draft pick

I'm sure those who hire GM's (meaning Luc and the team owners) decide the general direction the team should take (win-now vs.rebuild/retool), as that has significant implications to financial aspects of running a team.

Who they pick with #2 overall? That's between GM and scouts.

 

[XPantericA]

So… if Turc and Sami take over 3C and 4C, I guess that means Holland will be pursuing a scoring winger this season with the added cap space. Tuch! Tuch! Tuch!

They’ve been looking for this elusive scoring winger since the early 2000s.

 

[VCRW]

They’ve been looking for this elusive scoring winger since the early 2000s.

Luc and company will target Tuch and get a damaged Laine instead???

 

[Clif]

There was even talk entering the draft that NYR may choose to draft Byfield over Lafreneire at #1 (a few sources stating they were considering doing so).

Most believed Stutlze would be good, but it was a surprise to most just how good he has turned out to be. His relentless effort to improve and ability to build the defensive side of his game really catapulted him forward after joining the league.

Yep! Those were legitimate reports. To be fair, there are posters on here who state they understand the Byfield pick but in retrospect they believe Stutzle would have been the better choice. No problem there. But of Blake’s notable mistakes, I don’t think we can call drafting Byfield one of them. It made sense.

Q has grown defensively under Hiller but this as far as Hiller can take him. I wait unpatiently for a new coach to take his game further.

Ugh… wouldn’t have brought up Byfield/Stutzle if I thought “wokeness” would be atupidly brought up.

To be clear, I think they chose wrong. The scouts wanted Stutzle. Blake obviously believed he was going to be better. He was wrong.

Frankly, to argue against myself - Stutzle should’ve went first anyway and we would’ve been stuck with Lafrenière.

Rob Blake and the scouts always did what they thought was best for the team - they wanted to win badly. They just made key mistakes that derailed the retool, in my opinion.

The irony of people citing “wokeness” is that they are the reason we have wokeness. Saying a player ranked second overall who was taken second overall is because of diversity is bringing race into it. They are the ones making this about race, hence the need for education. Which they call woke…

Re: the scouts I know Euro Marko Ruttu was all-in on Stutzle but my understanding is Yanetti and at least several others wanted Byfield. This is from KOTP podcasts with Yanetti to source my understanding. Alternative takes?

 

[symbology]

Thank you. What an absurd and unserious post from @King of Pentacle5. Byfield was ranked ahead of Stutzle at number 2 in multiple final draft rankings, might we all remember. This Stutzle revisionism is acting like the Kings made a reach pick by not taking the consensus third over the consensus second prospect.

afterall, NYR still took the consensus number one prospect in that draft. What were they thinking? :/sarcasm font

Yes, QB was ranked ahead of Stutzle in some rankings, but I think Stutzle was ranked 2nd in the majority of them. They Kings went for QB because he had great size, speed, skill and he filled a need at center. QB was a little bit of a higher risk pick at #2 with the possibly of providing an absolutely huge reward. Stutzle was the safer pick.

You cannot blame LA for going for QB. I think if you asked all the GM's at the time who they would have taken, it would have been close to a 50/50 response.

It was kind of like Doughty vs Petro in 2008. Both great young players, but Drew was ahead of Petro in development. Many said that Petro would become the best defensemen out of that draft once he matured etc. They two players have had similar careers and I think one could argue for either as being the best D out of the 2008 draft.

So, I see it as the Kings made the "Petro" pick with QB and we are still waiting to see how it turns out. (yes, the consensus for Drew going at #2 was huge, but at the time there was a lot of talk about Petro being the better of the two in a short amount of time.) Not a true perfect comparison, but similar situation.... I guess.

 

[Bollocks]

Yep! Those were legitimate reports. To be fair, there are posters on here who state they understand the Byfield pick but in retrospect they believe Stutzle would have been the better choice. No problem there. But of Blake’s notable mistakes, I don’t think we can call drafting Byfield one of them. It made sense.

Q has grown defensively under Hiller but this as far as Hiller can take him. I wait unpatiently for a new coach to take his game further.

The irony of people citing “wokeness” is that they are the reason we have wokeness. Saying a player ranked second overall who was taken second overall is because of diversity is bringing race into it. They are the ones making this about race, hence the need for education. Which they call woke…

Re: the scouts I know Euro Marko Ruttu was all-in on Stutzle but my understanding is Yanetti and at least several others wanted Byfield. This is from KOTP podcasts with Yanetti to source my understanding. Alternative takes?

This.

Poor judgement on Cal extension, underestimating known issues with PLD and Fiala (both without a doubt very talented, but challenged in certain regards), I guess also hiring Hiller instead of Sturm, who would have 2 seasons of recent AHL HC success under his belt, lack of "recycling" prospects that were unlikely to make the team for picks...

There's a lot to point out, drafting QB isn't one of those things as it's pure hindsight.

 

[Clif]

Yes, QB was ranked ahead of Stutzle in some rankings, but I think Stutzle was ranked 2nd in the majority of them. They Kings went for QB because he had great size, speed, skill and he filled a need at center. QB was a little bit of a higher risk pick at #2 with the possibly of providing an absolutely huge reward. Stutzle was the safer pick.

You cannot blame LA for going for QB. I think if you asked all the GM's at the time who they would have taken, it would have been close to a 50/50 response.

It was kind of like Doughty vs Petro in 2008. Both great young players, but Drew was ahead of Petro in development. Many said that Petro would become the best defensemen out of that draft once he matured etc. They two players have had similar careers and I think one could argue for either as being the best D out of the 2008 draft.

So, I see it as the Kings made the "Petro" pick with QB and we are still waiting to see how it turns out. (yes, the consensus for Drew going at #2 was huge, but at the time there was a lot of talk about Petro being the better of the two in a short amount of time.) Not a true perfect comparison, but similar situation.... I guess.

I’m not familiar with all the rankings out there but NHL Central Scouting had Byfield at 2 so that stands out. I did a quick check and Pronman for the Athletic and ESPN also had Byfield at 2. McKeen had Stutzle at 2.

But more importantly is what you said in that he was a large skilled and very fast center. And being the youngest player in that tier carried so much promise of untapped potential.

The Petro example is interesting and if it takes Byfield that much longer to develop then so be it. I’m pretty much writing off this season due to Hiller. I said this needed to be a big step year for him, 70 pts to show he was on track to eventually become a ppg player, but that’ll shift to next year for me wirh a new coach.