Kempe Contract Watch Thread {Signed 8-year, $85 million - $10.63 AAV}

[VCRW]

Then why didn't Byfield get the chance to do so? Last I checked he was the #2 overall pick and had a ton more skill that Iafallo even on draft day.

The point again is the Kings were not the type to give rookies heavy minutes, or let them step straight to the NHL without first proving themselves in the AHL. Additionally, Iafallo was not on the top line due to skill - it was largely due to his ability to gel with Kopitar.

Because Q was way too raw and had so many rough edges. He was definitely not NHL ready at 18. Hell, we are still discussing the slow pace of his evolution and still using the word “potential “ at age 23.

Once again, I have always been on Team Q and felt Rob made the right choice at the time. But the subsequent events that have resulted in this team having nowhere to go with this current roster have made me wonder about the wisdom of picking Byfield over Stutzle. In my case, It’s not buyer’s remorse. But one can connect the dots to each bad move Blake made subsequent to that draft day.

 

[symbology]

So we have a few losses mixed in with a few wins, and now we’re trading everybody on the team. Right right right.

Well, the team kind of sucks, Holland does suck, Hiller sucks, Kings front office sucks. Kempe is yet to sign a new deal. Kopi is gone after this year. The Kings currently have two 1C/2C forwards and at the end of the year one will be gone. Where do they get the replacement for the 2nd? No prospect in the pipeline, nothing in the pipeline to trade away for one.

This was to be the year the Kings elevate their team/game and make a push for a deep playoff run. We are almost 1/5 the way through the season. The only thing I have seen from this team is, well garbage.

With that being said, it seems that the conversations happening on this board these days are fitting IMO.

 

[symbology]

Then why didn't Byfield get the chance to do so? Last I checked he was the #2 overall pick and had a ton more skill that Iafallo even on draft day.

The point again is the Kings were not the type to give rookies heavy minutes, or let them step straight to the NHL without first proving themselves in the AHL. Additionally, Iafallo was not on the top line due to skill - it was largely due to his ability to gel with Kopitar.

How much time did Iafallo spend in the AHL? How many years did it take for him to get up to the 1st line and start playing important minutes?

Yes, he was a collegiate player, but an NHL rookie none the less. Laferrier also stepped in as a rookie. So, it is not "rookies" as you say. It is due to age and inexperience. Stutzle was rookie of the year in Germany's pro league. He had the maturity, abilities and enough experience to be given an opportunity to play in the NHL out of the draft. Even on the LA Kings.

 

[symbology]

Because Q was way too raw and had so many rough edges. He was definitely not NHL ready at 18. Hell, we are still discussing the slow pace of his evolution and still using the word “potential “ at age 23.

Once again, I have always been on Team Q and felt Rob made the right choice at the time. But the subsequent events that have resulted in this team having nowhere to go with this current roster have made me wonder about the wisdom of picking Byfield over Stutzle. In my case, It’s not buyer’s remorse. But one can connect the dots to each bad move Blake made subsequent to that draft day.

To add to this.

Byfield is a very good player in the NHL. However, at this point in his career he is not able to consistently take his game up a notch. He is still not as good as Stutzle. Not the same players, so each is going to be better / worse at certain elements of the game.

Let's not lose sight of what happened at the 2020 draft. The Kings drafted for "need" instead of taking the "best player available". It is what it is. They took a shot to find a replacement for Kopi. That is understandable. However, the plan has not come to fruition just yet. It still may, but not as of yet and we are in year 6 of that plan. I still think there is a chance that he gets there, we will see.

 

[hokiecat]

It's silly to think he would have gotten the same opportunity to step right into a L1 position with the Kings. Kings would have slow burned him in the minors and then brought him up to limit him to 8-10 minutes per game. By now, he would be playing full time shifts, but his opportunity to develop would have taken a very different path.

Flip it, and Byfield would have jumped right into key minutes with Ottawa and likely have developed much faster in the process. I wouldn't be surprised had he gotten drafted by Ottawa he'd have already established himself as a regular point per game player.

If that's the case, then the entire Kings front office needs to be fired for mismanaging prospects over and over and over. QB was more of a project player while Stuzle was more plug-and-play due to his time in the DEL. But we're 5 years past the draft and almost everyone who is going to make the NHL is playing in it.

Also maybe Byfield is just very very good but not amazing. I used Mark Scheifele as a comp and that was not well received even though he's a nearly PPG player who was 3rd in NHL scoring before last night. I still think QB can be a 1C but not at the level of the guy who sells tickets like MacK or McDavid.

 

[DryKing]

How much time did Iafallo spend in the AHL? How many years did it take for him to get up to the 1st line and start playing important minutes?

Yes, he was a collegiate player, but an NHL rookie none the less. Laferrier also stepped in as a rookie. So, it is not "rookies" as you say. It is due to age and inexperience. Stutzle was rookie of the year in Germany's pro league. He had the maturity, abilities and enough experience to be given an opportunity to play in the NHL out of the draft. Even on the LA Kings.

Ah so your argument is Iafallo, who was not drafted by the Kings, jumped straight to the NHL after 4 years of college which is the equivalent of an 18 year old fresh draft pick doing it. Come one man, it's like you have paid zero attention to how the Kings Organization was operating at the time. How about you name me a kings forward who went straight from the draft to the NHL within the past 8 years... None? How about 10 years.... None again? Can you name the last one to do so when Rob Blake was the GM?

Laferriere stepped in as a rookie? Dude he went to 2 years of college after the draft, so nice one but no he did not stop in as an 18 year after the draft nor was he given key minutes out of the gate upon joining the NHL (if fact he is still not yet getting key NHL minutes).

Like I stated, Stutzle would have had to spend time in the AHL and prove himself there before joining the NHL squad and which time he would not have been granted key minutes his first season. By this time he would be a key player on the team for sure, but it he would have taken an elogated path to get there, compared to a team like Ottawa.

 

[DryKing]

Because Q was way too raw and had so many rough edges. He was definitely not NHL ready at 18. Hell, we are still discussing the slow pace of his evolution and still using the word “potential “ at age 23.

Once again, I have always been on Team Q and felt Rob made the right choice at the time. But the subsequent events that have resulted in this team having nowhere to go with this current roster have made me wonder about the wisdom of picking Byfield over Stutzle. In my case, It’s not buyer’s remorse. But one can connect the dots to each bad move Blake made subsequent to that draft day.

You can argue that, sure. But Stutzle was not "Kings" NHL ready either as the Kings put so much emphasis at the time of being a 2-way player. Stutzle grew significantly on the defensive end pretty rapidly, but his first two seasons in the NHL he was not getting it done on the defensive side of the ice. First season he was just overall lacking defensively, Second season he took a big step forward and become strong on 1:1 defense but still wouldn't have been up to the Kings standards. Season 3 he was good enough to play a 2-way game on the Kings and at that point likely would have started to get key minutes on the team.

 

[DryKing]

If that's the case, then the entire Kings front office needs to be fired for mismanaging prospects over and over and over. QB was more of a project player while Stuzle was more plug-and-play due to his time in the DEL. But we're 5 years past the draft and almost everyone who is going to make the NHL is playing in it.

Also maybe Byfield is just very very good but not amazing. I used Mark Scheifele as a comp and that was not well received even though he's a nearly PPG player who was 3rd in NHL scoring before last night. I still think QB can be a 1C but not at the level of the guy who sells tickets like MacK or McDavid.

I totally agree with you.

 

[VCRW]

Also maybe Byfield is just very very good but not amazing… I still think QB can be a 1C but not at the level of the guy who sells tickets like MacK or McDavid.

Exactly

 

[symbology]

Ah so your argument is Iafallo, who was not drafted by the Kings, jumped straight to the NHL after 4 years of college which is the equivalent of an 18 year old fresh draft pick doing it. Come one man, it's like you have paid zero attention to how the Kings Organization was operating at the time. How about you name me a kings forward who went straight from the draft to the NHL within the past 8 years... None? How about 10 years.... None again? Can you name the last one to do so when Rob Blake was the GM?

Laferriere stepped in as a rookie? Dude he went to 2 years of college after the draft, so nice one but no he did not stop in as an 18 year after the draft nor was he given key minutes out of the gate upon joining the NHL (if fact he is still not yet getting key NHL minutes).

Like I stated, Stutzle would have had to spend time in the AHL and prove himself there before joining the NHL squad and which time he would not have been granted key minutes his first season. By this time he would be a key player on the team for sure, but it he would have taken an elogated path to get there, compared to a team like Ottawa.

You said "rookie". Again. you said "ROOKIE". I said "rookie".

I did mention that Iafallo was a collegiate player. I also said that Stutzle played in the pro league in Germany. Neither of those players were in the same boat as Byfield. That was my point.

Stutzle was not coming out of juniors, he was coming from a pro league in Europe. Much like Kopitar when he came over. Iafallo was not coming from juniors, he was coming from college. Byfield came from juniors and the consensus was he was going to need time to develop, (both his game and physically) before playing in the NHL. The consensus on Stutzle was he was ready to play in the NHL. You can try to claim that these two players were at the same stage of development after the draft, but you would be on the opposite side of most of the opinions out there. It's like you paid zero attention to the level of development of these players before the draft.

I do not think anyone is here saying that Stutzle "would" have. Rather that he "could" have. You are the poster saying "would" have been in the AHL, never the NHL. That is rather silly to claim that you know absolutely what would have happened. Yes, we all know how the Kings treats young players, even older players like PLD. PLD played like crap for the Kings, but had a solid year on the Caps last year. That does not mean there would have been zero chance that Stutzle could have played for the Kings as a rookie. I mean, the kid did have a hat trick as a rookie.

As for Laf, when he came to camp folks were not saying he as going to play in the NHL. Everyone assumed he was AHL bound. He played his way onto the NHL roster. The Kings broke their rule there a little bit.

 

[aragorn]

What is the alternative?

It's not a question of the alternative. What you suggested is NOT a step back, it's a firesale with years of bottom dwelling unless we get lucky. It looks like Kempe doesn't really want to be here so trade his butt sometime in the season for the best picks we can get. Then with Kopi gone and the cap going up we'll see what happens. But we don't trade Kempe and Byfield. The last two home games were already like a vacant lot with more opposing fans than Kings fans so I don't think ownership wants it to get worse. Heck I'd trade Doughty before those other. We might lose him in '27 anyway when he becomes UFA and his 11 mil could get us two D's with extra to throw at a second line forward. Vegas did great with almost the entire team being 2nd liners.

 

[Statue4Deano]

What if the Oilers go all in for Kempe and Kuemper? What does that trade package look like?

 

[DryKing]

You said "rookie". Again. you said "ROOKIE". I said "rookie".

I did mention that Iafallo was a collegiate player. I also said that Stutzle played in the pro league in Germany. Neither of those players were in the same boat as Byfield. That was my point.

Stutzle was not coming out of juniors, he was coming from a pro league in Europe. Much like Kopitar when he came over. Iafallo was not coming from juniors, he was coming from college. Byfield came from juniors and the consensus was he was going to need time to develop, (both his game and physically) before playing in the NHL. The consensus on Stutzle was he was ready to play in the NHL. You can try to claim that these two players were at the same stage of development after the draft, but you would be on the opposite side of most of the opinions out there. It's like you paid zero attention to the level of development of these players before the draft.

I do not think anyone is here saying that Stutzle "would" have. Rather that he "could" have. You are the poster saying "would" have been in the AHL, never the NHL. That is rather silly to claim that you know absolutely what would have happened. Yes, we all know how the Kings treats young players, even older players like PLD. PLD played like crap for the Kings, but had a solid year on the Caps last year. That does not mean there would have been zero chance that Stutzle could have played for the Kings as a rookie. I mean, the kid did have a hat trick as a rookie.

As for Laf, when he came to camp folks were not saying he as going to play in the NHL. Everyone assumed he was AHL bound. He played his way onto the NHL roster. The Kings broke their rule there a little bit.

You know quite well I was talking about players coming straight out of the draft. Additionally, you have still not answered the question posed to you, so I will ask again - how many forwards went straight from the draft to the NHL under Blake as GM? How many of them were given key minutes their first season?

Organizations treat development of prospects differently, and the Kings were well known as being one of the slower Organizations to bring a prospect up to the NHL as well as one that had a high demand for a forward having a developed 2-way game by the time they were brought into the NHL (which Stutzle did not yet have).

Laf was a surprise for sure, but it does not break the Kings Org trend we are speaking about (as he had 2 years of college post draft). Additionally, he has yet to be given key minutes (PP1 and/or consistent top line duties) with over 2 seasons in.

 

[Pickle_Pucks]

What if the Oilers go all in for Kempe and Kuemper? What does that trade package look like?

I think they are about as empty as we are...though I'm sure they could come up with 2 2nds for Kuemper, I'd take that. Don't think they have the assets for Kempe unless we are willing to take 3 future 1st rounders, which aren't all that valuable. That would be terrible.

As for Kempe, I think Holland would (hopefullly) be looking at assets from the 23-25 draft class in lieu of future picks. Speeds up the timeline just a bit and gives you a bigger body of work to know what you are getting back.

CHI / NYI / DET / SJ / OTT / MTL / PHL all make logical trading partners.

But let's be real, he'll probably just deal Kempe straight up for Barzal

 

[symbology]

You know quite well I was talking about players coming straight out of the draft. Additionally, you have still not answered the question posed to you, so I will ask again - how many forwards went straight from the draft to the NHL under Blake as GM? How many of them were given key minutes their first season?

Organizations treat development of prospects differently, and the Kings were well known as being one of the slower Organizations to bring a prospect up to the NHL as well as one that had a high demand for a forward having a developed 2-way game by the time they were brought into the NHL (which Stutzle did not yet have).

Laf was a surprise for sure, but it does not break the Kings Org trend we are speaking about (as he had 2 years of college post draft). Additionally, he has yet to be given key minutes (PP1 and/or consistent top line duties) with over 2 seasons in.

No, I did not know quite well. You said rookies. How many players did Blake draft that were 2nd overall and had already been playing against men in Europe? There is always a "first" for everything. Like dumping your Org's best goaltender of all time the way Blake did Quick. Whether Blake had ever done this or that is irrelevant. He never drafted a player like Stutzle. Do you think that if Blake was around and drafted Doughty, do you think 100% that Drew would have had to wait for years before playing in the NHL? Defensemen take so long to develop and all.......

QB spent some time in the AHL before joining the Kings. Where did he really develop his defensive game? IMO, that was in the NHL. You seem to think because he played in the AHL first, that he was a strong defensive player by his 1st NHL game. That is far from reality.

This is my last comment on this subject.

 

[Statue4Deano]

I think they are about as empty as we are...though I'm sure they could come up with 2 2nds for Kuemper, I'd take that. Don't think they have the assets for Kempe unless we are willing to take 3 future 1st rounders, which aren't all that valuable. That would be terrible.

As for Kempe, I think Holland would (hopefullly) be looking at assets from the 23-25 draft class in lieu of future picks. Speeds up the timeline just a bit and gives you a bigger body of work to know what you are getting back.

CHI / NYI / DET / SJ / OTT / MTL / PHL all make logical trading partners.

But let's be real, he'll probably just deal Kempe straight up for Barzal

A bidding war for Kempe could be a ticket out of the blackhole but I sure as hell do not trust this front office to do it correctly.

 

[hokiecat]

You know quite well I was talking about players coming straight out of the draft. Additionally, you have still not answered the question posed to you, so I will ask again - how many forwards went straight from the draft to the NHL under Blake as GM? How many of them were given key minutes their first season?

Organizations treat development of prospects differently, and the Kings were well known as being one of the slower Organizations to bring a prospect up to the NHL as well as one that had a high demand for a forward having a developed 2-way game by the time they were brought into the NHL (which Stutzle did not yet have).

Laf was a surprise for sure, but it does not break the Kings Org trend we are speaking about (as he had 2 years of college post draft). Additionally, he has yet to be given key minutes (PP1 and/or consistent top line duties) with over 2 seasons in.

The number of players who go from draft to NHL is very low. Maybe a portion of the top 10 overall and then an occasional overage player who goes later in the draft (Tanner Pearson but he only got a playoff game in 12-13). You're asking for how many straight to NHL did Blake have when only Byfield and Turc even are in the population to do so and neither was NHL ready (Turc going to play for Granato in college).

The Kings apparently just suck at developing prospects. Kempe also took a while to come up and he never really improved his game in the AHL. I remember reading at the time that maybe his AHL scoring was down because he was playing with slower and less talented linemates. Anyhow, what you are conveniently neglecting is that Byfield was always projected to be a longer-term prospect (puppy growing into his paws) while Stutzle was more NHL ready (played against men in Germany). You've been told that time and time again and continue to ignore it. Or are you just like the Kings and so stubborn that a player who is NHL-ready will still have to marinate in the AHL because that is the only recipe that we have?

As Symbology says (and I agree with), the AHL time did nothing for Byfield. He was essentially a non-factor when he came up and was in a 3C role. It wasn't until he played wing under Kopi that he started making an impact offensively and developed his defensive chops.

Let's just cut to the chase.
1. The Kings drafted the wrong player if they wanted to get the star. Byfield could be a 1C, but Stutzle looks to be the superstar of the draft. A bunch of us have been saying it for years. Drafting 18 year olds is a lottery ticket and it stinks that we chose the wrong one.
2. Kings development system sucks. Some teams fast track players and others don't but it really doesn't matter. Almost nobody from 2021 went straight to NHL (maybe got the < 10 game audition) but players like Hughes, Power, McTavish, Guenther, etc are starting to break out now. The 2020 redrafts usually have QB at ~6th.

 

[symbology]

What if the Oilers go all in for Kempe and Kuemper? What does that trade package look like?

That would be a good question. No 1st this year for them. So, prospects and a 27 it is. Problem is, Kings are ranked 27th and the Oilers 23rd in prospect depth (depending on where you look). So, not a lot to work with. Maybe one of, or both of those youngsters the Oilers rushed into the NHL this year? Oilers have no cap either, so?

 

[VCRW]

What if the Oilers go all in for Kempe and Kuemper? What does that trade package look like?

Oilers don’t have the assets. And they need to use what little they do have to acquire a competent goaltender.

 

[hokiecat]

Discussions began over the summer with a goal to sign him before camp from what I understand. It's been awfully quiet on the news front...until now. Pay the man. You cannot let him walk after the season ends nor should they trade him.

Eyes on McDavid, Kaprizov & others as September arrives — The Fourth Period

New deals for the NHL’s top stars? Carey Price’s contract on the move? David Pagnotta reports on this and other tidbits from across the NHL.

www.thefourthperiod.com

"...while over there summer there seemed to be a financial gap between Kempe and the Los Angeles Kings – and I’m not sure that has closed much, so far.

Kempe is looking for a deal in the $10 million AAV range over eight years, while the Kings started talks under the $9 million mark. With Anze Kopitar likely playing in his last NHL season, the Kings want to compete this season and getting Kempe locked into a new deal is important."

Bumping this since, according to reports, talks have resumed and Kempe is now looking at the Necas 11.5M as a target. Holland is a clown.