Kings trading Quick and a first plus to Columbus?0

[jammer06]

Do we know this? I didn't see that Quickie wants to play past this season.

Reported here:

https://twitter.com/johnondrasik/status/1631015889419264000?t=ip8FtwhNWeKKysgF37-QqQ&s=19

More clarity on the Quick trade. Seems he had let the team know he wanted to continue playing beyond this year and would not retire a
@lakings
as did Brown.

Based on this information Blake wasn't doing him wrong at all. It wasn't a priority for Quick to retire a King. As for a heads up.....Nobody gets a heads up they're about to be traded unless they've asked for a trade and at that it's a "we'll see what we can do".

 

[jt]

Do we know this? I didn't see that Quickie wants to play past this season.

Quick's and Blake's comments already posted, and some GM will be willing to sign him, given that Washington signed Lundqvist and Fleury re-signed with Minnesota.

Honestly seeing all these top teams going all in this year, I kind of wish the Kings didn't do this trade. Yes we need a goalie and a d-man and this definitely helps, but imo, I don't see the Kings being able to beat some of these top teams this year. Would have been best to just stay put and keep their #1 pick or at least wait till summer and then make moves. Plus this way Quick could have stayed and then retired after the season (as I am sure the Kings would have told him they are not going to re-sign him). Although I am sure he can still if the NHL does "sign 1 day contracts to retire with that team" like the NFL does.

In the end the Kings did get better for sure but still.

Getting the kids experience in the playoffs, especially if it's winning a round or 2, which is very doable this year. Also, the tops teams in the west are very beatable, even Colorado.

 

[VCRW]

Looking for Blake to add a bigger, stronger 3/4C guy before the end of the day tomorrow. The available cap space after the Quick trade makes it possible to add a good guy and move Lizzo to wing where he belongs.

Let's go, Rob! Make it happen!

All athletes want to win and this trade gives the Kings a far better chance to move forward in the big dance. I don't understand those who seem to be willing to accept losing with Quick just to keep him on the team for a few weeks more. Sentimentality should never overrule logic in maximizing the progress of a professional sports team. And I am certain Blake was never planning to offer Quick another contract based on his declining play this season.

We will love you forever, Quickie, but the team needs wins during this stretch run. How many of us were actually confident the team had the best chance to win on any given night with Quick in the net?

 

[Illegal_Stick]

I'm sure like everyone, emotions have settled over the past few days. Like the deal from a hockey standpoint. Tempted as I sit here in Ottawa to say he should've got Chycrun, but come on... if that deal had been offered to us, he'd be on the Kings already. So now, Ottawa has Stutzle and Chycrun over our heads. I'll hear about it in the dressing room tonight. I am also tempted to say I still think Blake should've talked to Quick a while ago to let him know a trade COULD happen, but I think this is what happened - Blake was probably tempted to have that conversation a few weeks ago, then Quick won a couple of games. I have no doubt and I believe I said it in the game thread, day of - the Rangers game was a clear - okay, let's see if he's really pulled it together or not. And the answer was not. The one thing that could've happened at that moment is Blake could've pulled him aside and said we may trade you. That's the one window he had and the only part I will take issue with. It takes balls to make a move that betters the team and upsets the fans.

 

[Kingscup4426]

There's something to be said about loyalty. Quick brought this team two cups and he deserved more. To TM and Blake, he was the guy that ousted them from 3-0 lead. The price for disloyalty is a team of players who will give no loyalty back. Just like how TM ran SJ to the ground.

Yeah that is not really correct. TM did not run SJ into the ground. He never won a cup with them, but always had them competing for cups and in the playoffs. Don't confuse cant win, and hasn't won. Unfortunately loyalty is something romanticized by fans, but I am not certain that it comes into play much with contract negotiations. These players and their agents make it a point to either stay in a comfortable situation for the player or make their business decisions and test free agency. The players are all paid handsomely and guaranteed contracts, so I would say these 10 year deals is the loyalty, the Kings were loyal by guaranteeing money for a guy who could have dislocated a hip 1 game into a 820 game contract.

I understand what you are saying, but I think everyone in that business understands it is a business and the home town "discounts" we hear of are just as much for the player to stay comfortable, at home in an environment they know, and hopefully in a team that can surround them with pieces, as it is good will toward their organization or fan base.

End of the day, when emotions die down and shock wears off, everyone will recall the business side of things, this will not be held over Blake by players either on the Kings or not. Sucks to see a fan favorite go, but Blake got usable players right now for some picks and a guy who was going to sit on the end of the bench the rest of the season and play somewhere else next year.

 

[Kingscup4426]

I think what is getting lost in this thread is that it isn't only about trading Quick. Rather it is (i) a first round pick was given up for two rentals, at least one of whom has publicly said that he intends to test free agency, while (in my humble opinion) the team is likely not good enough to get out of the West with Colorado getting healthy and certainly not good enough to beat the likes of Boston, Toronto or Tampa in a seven game final series and, as such, a trade to further build the team for the future, even if overpaying for the player, rather than playing for the present, may have made more sense; and (ii) that Quick did not get the same courtesy that the likes of Carter received (and that Blake went out of his way to discuss when Carter was traded), that the veteran players would not be blind sided, which clearly did not happen in this instance. Put differently, while one can debate whether or not this was a good trade from a long term hockey perspective, I think many of us feel that it wasn't handled properly - there is a right way to do something and a wrong way to do something and it sounds like the latter happened here.

Sometimes though you don't have time to do it "right." Looking to fill 2 holes that one team had the ability to help with. CBJ wanted the picks, they did not need/want JQ, but the Kings could not fill the 2 holes, take the CBJ players and keep JQ on the books. I doubt JQ was ever a target for CBJ or Blake, but when they reached an impasse on the trade and needed to free up cap space to fill the 2 holes Blake probably did not have time to ask JQ's permission.

I am with you it sucks, and yes its a questionable move to give up those picks, with the Kings not being a clear cut contender. But again in 2012 and 2014, its not like they were a clear cut cup favorite. Point is it is likely with these moves the Kings will make round 2 or 3, the pick should be late in rounds and they get a chance to look at 2 pieces that could fit very well into the club. I don't know that we will have an answer until the season is over. Of course if JQ was going to be moved we all want to think of him being on board and happy with it, but his life is in LA, he was never going to be happy with a trade out of LA, and if Blake waited and lost the opportunity to bring in the CBJ guys that would have been worse.

 

[Clif]

This isn’t just about Quick’s feelings. It’s about the effect of morale in the room. Given that Quick didn’t see this coming, there are legitimate questions over how this was handled. Did this disrespect him? If players think so, that’s not a good thing.

Part of a winning culture is still about a brand, and a buy-in to what a team represents in its history and its future. The connection of the cup-winning core players to the current trajectory is a part of that. Quick adds to the mythos. He’s a legend. Disrespecting a legend could be detrimental.

This also has nothing to do with Quick retiring next year or not. Him leaving in free agency is not a slight. Blindsiding him in a trade is.

This is not anything like DL’s loyalty pitfalls, which was all about one player in Richards who had way more term than a mere 20 games. DL’s real downfall was dumb trades. And he wasn’t loyal to Mitchell for one. Let him walk to go mentor Eklblad.

Also this isn’t in the same universe as the Carter trade. Johnson wasn’t Quick and Gavrikov/Korpisalo sure as hell aren’t Carter. Further, that was a profoundly unique trade given Carter feeling wronged by PHI and getting stuck in CLB with lots of term left. Coming to LA was a new lease on life - not to mention his best friend was on the team…and had also felt wronged by PHI. And yes, that feeling motivated them both. Doing right or wrong by players matters. Big picture, will probably never see a Kings trade quite like that again. Neither this trade nor any since compare to it.

I think we all get that the team is more talented now than on Tuesday. But when you’re rebuilding a team, including its culture, there is risk in a move like this in how it was done.

 

[Kingscup4426]

I think we all get that the team is more talented now than on Tuesday. But when you’re rebuilding a team, including its culture, there is risk in a move like this in how it was done.

This was a clear indication the rebuild is OVER, and the future is now!

You don't make this move if you are still rebuilding, we gave up picks. Blake sees an opportunity to win THIS year. In terms of messages being sent and the culture of a team, it more likely sent the message from the front office of we are ready to WIN, NOW.

If I am a player in that room, I am at first shocked a legend is gone and then extremely excited that management brought in tools to help us win this year. Standing pat tells the players not yet, making this move invigorates excitement and raises expectations. Also possibly sends the message of you need to produce, or the team needs to move on from you.

As a fan, I will miss JQ and sucks that he is gone from a I like that player and what he meant to the cup run years, but I am stoked that we are now back in the conversation of winning a cup and going deep in the playoffs and has management willing to make the hard calls to put the team in a position to win. Blake is not stupid, in fact he is very cunning and finds ways to get what he wants accomplished as a player and a GM. You may disagree with the tactics, but he has always put himself and his position at the forefront. Since he is at the head of the team now and its success reflects on him, you better believe the Kings are in good hands and decisions are being made with the team's success in mind.

Rebuilds are exactly rebuilding to these moments...otherwise why bother, just slum along in the black hole for years on end with no real chance at winning.

 

[Ice24]

It happened; it sucks. Now let's all move on and I am one of the biggest Quick supporters. When the emotions settle, Quick will come back and retire as a King. The Kings made a move, it's done.

 

[aragorn]

Seeing he planned on playing another few seasons, I don't feel bad for Quickie at all. I feel sorry that it's the end of an era and i loved all he gave us. Zero chance we were re-signing him so he was not going to retire a King no matter what.

 

[J~]

A lot of talk of doing right by our legends - isn't it equally the right thing for Doughty and Kopitar to give them a chance to be competitive in the playoffs again? They are also legends, but they are legends that are still playing at a very high level and equally deserve the fans' and front office's respect.

Prior to this trade, we were a 2 week Copley injury from having one of Doughty and Kopitar's last seasons gone in the wind.

 

[SaltyPuck]

A lot of talk of doing right by our legends - isn't it equally the right thing for Doughty and Kopitar to give them a chance to be competitive in the playoffs again? They are also legends, but they are legends that are still playing at a very high level and equally deserve the fans' and front office's respect.

Prior to this trade, we were a 2 week Copley injury from having one of Doughty and Kopitar's last seasons gone in the wind.

Exactly this. I had to sleep on the news to understand that, while the situation with JQ stings, I totally appreciate RB making moves to help the team now. My only real concern is over the rental aspect of it all. Ok, so we have a better shot to do post-season damage now...but do we think our window for contending is as open as its going to get now, or in the near future? If the near future, then IMO it's hard to evaluate this trade without knowing if these rentals fit AND resign...

 

[SaltyPuck]

Also, here's a video of an interview with Luc who also says that JQ indicated he wanted to keep playing: https://www.nhl.com/video/luc-robitaille-on-kings-season/t-277350912/c-15591363

 

[jammer06]

the memes have been amazing though:

 

[LAKingSteve]

And, he was traded to Vegas today. Love him, hope he's swiss cheese for the rest of the season and doesn't shut us out if we meet in the playoffs.

 

[Kurisu]

Criag Button on NHL radio just said with these issues addressed by the Kings, he expects us to compete with Colorado as the favorites to come out of the west.

 

[symbology]

Criag Button on NHL radio just said with these issues addressed by the Kings, he expects us to compete with Colorado as the favorites to come out of the west.

I agree with Butthead Button on this. The Kings are looking good to be one of the 8 teams competing to get out of the west.

Need to use up that cap space they have, otherwise......

Go Blake Go......

 

[symbology]

And, he was traded to Vegas today. Love him, hope he's swiss cheese for the rest of the season and doesn't shut us out if we meet in the playoffs.

That is not nice. Let him play lights out against every team, except the LA Kings. He should show us the cheese for sure.

 

[Kurisu]

I didn't really know a thing about Gavrikov until this week, but to the eye test watching him tonight he is exactly what I imagined we needed. Big guy, good reach, defensive minded LD with some physicality.

 

[Bollocks]

First off, thanks for the detailed reply. You really took a lot of time to format the responses and make intelligent points. I still don't agree with all the takes though. But definitely respect the time you put in and all that.

I enjoy these debates, so...no problem.

They are both rentals. Neither is extended at the moment. We can hope that they fall in love with El Segundo and extend with us but we don't know if that will happen. We have a pair of guys for a couple of months and then Blake gets to negotiate as the incumbent. One rumored asking price for McCabe was a second to get him and a first to get him with salary retained. I'd much rather have paid the first to get McCabe for 2.25 years instead of 0.25. We've have a solid defenseman at a bargain price. That is the attraction with Chychrun too-- a top pair guy for a middle pair price for 2.25 years. Instead Blake got 2 rental players to fit into our roster. Hope is not a plan. The reality is neither of these guys is more than a rental at this point and there is no cost certainty with them after the season ends.

Personally, I can't ignore the chances of a rental to sign with us. I don't know, the fact that both are rentals doesn't bother me as much. And why didn't they go after McCabe...I have no idea. Maybe they see something we don? It's their job to evaluate players vs. cost and negotiate...I doubt they liked McCabe and didn't try to trade for him. Don't you? There has to be some level of trust on relation fans vs. GM and his team.

Agree that we are probably 2nd best in the West after addressing the 2 biggest holes. I really like this roster, love Fiala and his skill, and the PP which will be a total asset in the playoffs.

We are likely 2nd best and which best were we in 2012? They - despite adding Carter at the deadline - barely made the playoffs.

They are addressed. I am not as enamored with Joonas as the what I'd say is a bit of a pollyanna crowd. We went from a journeyman to a 1B goaltender.
2019-20 Columbus Blue Jackets NHL 37 1 0 2126 92 0 2 2.60 19 12 5 938 0.911 9 0 0
2019-20 Cleveland Monsters AHL 1 0 0 62 2 0 0 1.95 1 0 0 32 0.941
2020-21 Columbus Blue Jackets NHL 33 1 2 1747 96 0 0 3.30 9 13 7 808 0.894 - - -
2021-22 Columbus Blue Jackets NHL 22 0 2 1128 78 0 0 4.15 7 11 0 556 0.877 - - -
2022-23 Columbus Blue Jackets NHL 28 0 0 1551 81 0 0 3.13 11 11 3 845 0.913
2022-23 Cleveland Monsters AHL 1 0 0 60 2 0 0 2.00 1 0 0 38 0.950

Looking at his stats, he's been good for 2 of 4 years and terrible for 2 of 4 (bottom 5 in GSAA in those 2). He has a good playoff run of 2 weeks. I'm not ready to call him a big-time playoff performer. He could be the "Druce on the Loose" of goalies where a guy was hot for 2 weeks, and that's all there was. He's good but he's certainly not Shesterkin and I'm not even convinced he is at the Keumper level.

But yes, these are certainly upgrades over Quick and Edler/Walker on the 3rd pair.

Fair points, yes. He's been inconsistent on a year-to-year basis. This year he's been good. What will happen down the line - nobody knows. But what else can the Kings do - proactively? Whoever with a visibly better track record would cost even more. Especially on an affordable, multi-year deal.

Or Dom and others like him are right and we bought the fools gold of the trade deadline. Hooray, we got Ben Chiarot 2.0! As a fan, I hope he fits in and plays well behind Mikey. But I see serious red flags when some of the best analytics minds were saying to avoid him and Edmundson at all costs.

Possibly. There are risks for sure, but where do you end up if you don't take risks? Besides, there are certain question marks with Chychrun, too. I mean, with the price that the AZ ended up asking maybe he's not considered as such a surefire slam dunk. And the Kings would still need to shed the cap space to make a trade in a way that AZ doesn't get any salary back (which we now know was the case) AND solve their goalie issue (trade either Quick or Cal and getting someone as a capable backup). Could end up costing a 1st, two 2nds for Chych and then another 1st and a two 2nds equal worth to solve the goalie issue. In which case you better hope Chychrun delivers big.

Maybe the management has someone eyed up at the FA that will be a better longer term answer? Maybe they want to give a proper, long term chance to either Bjornfot or Moverare next season before they start looking at long term answers that cost assets? Based on how good Rob's team building was until now I really doubt this was a desperation move with no plan. But I could be wrong.

Strawman argument with Cal and Quick. How about don't trade for rentals? Also, I think we have 6M in cap space right now. So potentially do nothing. Or Quick to minors. I'm not upset about "doing Quick dirty" or anything like that. More curious why Blake needs to have 6M in cap space right now. Is someone getting added? If not, I hope he is going to weaponize the space in some way. Boston needs to shed 4.5M in cap space right now to fit under the cap.

This is a good point, yes.

It is an improvement no doubt. I still question if it is the best use of our assets to get rentals.
And I still think the reality is Colorado crushes us and the teams loading up in the east do too. And that is the rub for me. We made trades to fix today's roster which did nothing for future seasons rosters. Those were real assets that we gave up. I think back to 2014. When I watched that team, I always had this thought "you know who determines if we win tonight or not? The Kings do". That team could beat any opponent. They were stacked. Kopi and Brown, the 70s line, Stolly, a loaded defense, Quick and Jones in net. That was a truly dominant team. If the Kings played their game, they'd win a 7-game series against anyone with no doubts. The current team is very good. But we're still waiting for another breakout player in the forward prospect pool. Somebody to push Lizotte to the 13th forward. We still need a better 3rd pair defenseman. And the goaltending is improved but still a bit of a question mark. The Kings now have a punchers chance in the playoffs but so does Edmonton with their 2 superstars. But we're still a ways away from the teams which have totally loaded up. So why go in on pure rentals? [OK, now I'm sounding like a broken record]

Do they?

Our future season roster is improved by out kids improving.

The kids will improve the most by playing competitive, meaningful hockey. By far the most.

And 2014 is like saying what this Kings roster will look like in 2025. The real comparable is 2012. Sure, that playoff run was almost historic, but...if you don't believe you can win as an underdog, good luck waiting for the perfect storm of a perfectly built team on Tampa's level. With that mindset you can wait until 2030 for the next Cup.

So AZ would not take any players back for Chychrun? That is an interesting take. A first and 2 seconds would have been a fair price. Chychrun would have fit on Tuesday if the Kings traded picks/prospects and Lemieux. The numbers were not that hard. The goalie issue still remains but the roster would be stacked and cost controlled. Joonas makes 1.3M so if you traded for him and buried Quick in the minors then the math works out.

As far as packages, I have no clue what Armstrong was thinking to wait all that time and end up with nothing but picks and only a single first rounder (even if it is Ottawa's).

AZ is not a divisional rival any more. They are in the Central. So it is a conference rival if such a thing exists. And Armstrong would be a complete idiot to give up on more assets in the rebuild because Chychrun would face his team 1 extra time per year for the next 2 years. That's absurd. If Blake could trade player X to the Sharks/Ducks for a first, he should make that deal rather than take a 2nd or 3rd from a team in the East. That's simply irresponsible. And the Martin Jones deal(s) showed that savvy GMs can just flip a player back into your division; so all you really did is get less value for being stupid.

Some things were clarified publicly, yes. My bad about division rival...I'm still not used to these new divisions.

Maybe their GM got his hands tied by the owners. I'm not sure about McCabe (maybe they don't like him enough to commit long term to him) but I strongly believe that when it comes to Chychrun all kinds of options were explored and they simply couldn't find a deal.

There's 0% doubt the Kings are better this morning. The 2 largest holes in the roster have been addressed, in the short term. My complaints are : 1) pushing in a fairly significant amount of draft capitals for no control or cost certainty 2) overall it was still a half-hearted attempt. Like Dom said, Blake and the Kings got stuck in the middle ground of doing something but not getting players who are truly elite.

That said, we should win the Pacific now with the upgraded roster.

You're talking about this like it's a simple task to win every trade by a margin. It takes two to tango and to me all the signs point to AZ did not want to tango (and got burned subsequently), McCabe wasn't who they wanted and they liked solving both holes via one 1st rounder enough to do it.

How much future they mortgaged by trading (most likely quite late) 1st and 3rd rounders while having their prospect pool overflowing with prospects that can't even get a proper chance...well, you be the judge. You can't win by having the deepest prospect pool and playing it safe with 1st round exits.