Elliotte Friedman: Chychrun May Be Available
- Thread starter HeadInjury
- Start date
J
jt
Lurker
I did miss your bolding. So you're OK with losing these guys for nothing, rather than trade them (or other guys they'd replace) for the LD they need.
Arvidsson
Athanasiou
Lizotte
Andersson
Roy
Walker
Edler
Wolanin
Strand
Maatta
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I agree with JT.
Make a deal, even it it's painful.
Top pairing stud is a Must for Cup competition.
Due diligence and all that, but the reason to collect young assets is to get a Chychrun. Unless you create them out of nothing like Nashville, Anaheim, or Steve Yzerman, it's a lucky lottery pick, trade for a known, or pay through the the nose for a FA.
Make a deal, even it it's painful.
Top pairing stud is a Must for Cup competition.
Due diligence and all that, but the reason to collect young assets is to get a Chychrun. Unless you create them out of nothing like Nashville, Anaheim, or Steve Yzerman, it's a lucky lottery pick, trade for a known, or pay through the the nose for a FA.
That deal yes, if you change out either of Anderson or Bjornfoot for a forward I'm probably on board. Just as painful but less hole creating would be Iafallo. Especially if it gets you out of the 2022 1st. I still think the yote's balk at that much salary coming back (both your offer and mine) at them though. Your trade is saving 2 million next season (mine none) but depending on Anderson vs Bjornfoot you have an RFA raise coming, followed by quite a few more.
D
DarkLeftHand
Lurker
Agree with all those saying we need to make the trade, even if it’s a bit painful. You can’t lose sight of the fact that the talent on the team needs to be layered, in terms of age. We cannot go from our older veterans straight to our younger high in prospects because, those young prospects are still going to have growing pains In the NHL, after they’re done experiencing those same growing pains in the AHL
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D
DarkLeftHand
Lurker
Furthermore, people are clenching their butt holes about two young forwards, one of whom hasn’t scored in four games since returning from injury, and another who has shown to be injury prone on and off, along with having cold spells in the AHL. It’s absolutely possible that both Byfield and turcotte turn out to be 2nd and 3rd liners respectively. If Chychrun has proven he’s got the goods to be a #1 pair defender in the NHL, especially if he is in the top 10 of NHL #1 pairing talent level, I say you do it all day. High end forwards develop faster anyways, so we should absolutely recycle some of our current forward crop for a higher end defender.
Besides, I think many of you are delusional, and WAY under value Kopitar and Doughty. Don’t be surprised if we don’t see positional players reach their respective talent for another decade.. I wouldn’t be surprised if Byfield and Clarke both pale in comparison to the effectiveness that Drew and Anze have exhibited for a decade +
Besides, I think many of you are delusional, and WAY under value Kopitar and Doughty. Don’t be surprised if we don’t see positional players reach their respective talent for another decade.. I wouldn’t be surprised if Byfield and Clarke both pale in comparison to the effectiveness that Drew and Anze have exhibited for a decade +
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J
jt
Lurker
Not that I disagree, but then what do you do next year with the D?
Anderson-Doughty
Chychrun-Roy
Bjornfot-Durzi
Walker
Clarke
Wolanin
Strand
Moverare
Nousiainen
Spence
Faber
Who do you risk losing to waivers and what do you do with Walker (or Durzi) and Clarke? And what if Wolanin shows he's a legit top 6 D? And then in 23-24 it gets even more complicated when guys like Nousiainen, Spence, and Faber are pushing for spots with Clarke.
There's just too many quality D to keep them all. And that assumes they don't feel they need the steady veteran presence of Edler.
Clif
Super Star
The safe bet is that Roy and Walker are placeholders for Clarke and Faber. It?s already going to be interesting with Spence and Grans putting up a fight for a spot, and now toss in Durzi and the right side is bonkers. It?s why I?m perfectly comfortable losing Clarke for Chychrun, even if he is the clear best among those five. It?s worth it.
Wolanin should be dman #7 but that?s still a big if. Dude is 26 and hasn?t made a full time spot anywhere yet. The others you might just lose for nothing because there?s not a market for them. Losing players isn?t always bad asset management. They?re just tweeners, journeymen, and those who never make it.
Well to start with Clarke has to be part of the trade for the yotes so we wouldn't be worrying about him except when he comes to town to light the kings up.
Personally I've always like Walker far more than Roy. I'd be willing to package Roy along with any of Nouisainan, Spence, Faber or even Grange for the 30 yo dman vet this team needs. Actually I'd probably do Roy for McNabb this season just to get a head start on his UFA rights. I wouldn't be looking for a Justin Shultz type, more of a Erik Gudbranson type.
Wol is a great #7 but that's a limited time spot and if he gets claimed again, well he might just be someone's Kyle Quincy
Moverare and Nousiainen have been around so long it feels like every team has guys like them
Spence and Faber might be attractive to someone, but they are going to have to outplay someone. That someone is Walker who would be the last "bridge" player in the lineup if it's not Roy. I've said it before and nothings changed in my mind that Roy and Walker are third pair guys that should count their blessings to have a 5 year career. I like Walker more than Roy but that's a style issue. Best case scenario if you get that more vet D in there Roy or Walker (whoevers left) becomes your #7 . That's pretty decent depth if you can afford the cap hit there. Having a Anderson and Bjornfoot on cheaper deals now becomes a window issue for you in regards to the cap but all teams have that same struggle.
J
jt
Lurker
Ok, so in a nutshell the plan would be to have a top 7 of:
Anderson-Doughty
Chychrun-Walker
Bjornfot-Durzi
McNabb
I'm a little skeptical that McNabb would re-sign with the Kings for a 7th D role...OR the Kings would make Anderson or Bjornfot the 7th D. I also think Roy is exactly the kind of stable Norstrom-like D they need. But I'll play along.
They risk letting these guys go for nothing or trade for whatever they can get:
Wolanin
Strand
Moverare
Nousiainen (BTW, he's only 21)
And keep these guys in Ontario until/unless one can unseat Walker or Durzi.
Spence
Faber
Grans
Anderson-Doughty
Chychrun-Walker
Bjornfot-Durzi
McNabb
I'm a little skeptical that McNabb would re-sign with the Kings for a 7th D role...OR the Kings would make Anderson or Bjornfot the 7th D. I also think Roy is exactly the kind of stable Norstrom-like D they need. But I'll play along.
They risk letting these guys go for nothing or trade for whatever they can get:
Wolanin
Strand
Moverare
Nousiainen (BTW, he's only 21)
And keep these guys in Ontario until/unless one can unseat Walker or Durzi.
Spence
Faber
Grans
H
hokiecat
Lurker
For all the hatred that Roy gets (and I don't understand it), I'll point out that he is now 4th on the team in point shares. He basically plays the same game as Mikey Anderson but as RD instead of LD and has made a bigger impact this year. Anderson might have some future upside and it is nice that he has paired well with Doughty, but the reality is that he's got 1 assist in 29 games. He'd make a good Norstrom type like JT said.
Overall, though, nobody on the current roster is untouchable IMO and I'd move any of them to get a legit top-pairing guy. I don't see much difference between Roy and Anderson in the long-term and if AZ valued one significantly higher than the other in a trade package, then I'd give them whichever one they wanted.
Overall, though, nobody on the current roster is untouchable IMO and I'd move any of them to get a legit top-pairing guy. I don't see much difference between Roy and Anderson in the long-term and if AZ valued one significantly higher than the other in a trade package, then I'd give them whichever one they wanted.
santiclaws
I was in the pool!!
He has righted the ship somewhat, but for a large portion of the season he was an absolute turnover machine. A defenseman who is not much at the offensive end needs to be good in his own zone and Roy was a disaster. It was like Maata rubbed off on him. He's been doing better, hopefully he'll keep it up.
And I LOVED Norstrom. Roy is no Norstrom.
J
jt
Lurker
Time to bring this back to life. Friedman says the rumblings are starting again and the ask is Eichel prices:
1 top 6 center
1 top 4 D
1st rounder
Other prospects
So something like:
Turcotte
Clarke
2022 1st
2 of: Kupari/Fagemo/Pinelli/Helenius/Madden/JAD/Chromiak/Grans/Spence
1 top 6 center
1 top 4 D
1st rounder
Other prospects
So something like:
Turcotte
Clarke
2022 1st
2 of: Kupari/Fagemo/Pinelli/Helenius/Madden/JAD/Chromiak/Grans/Spence
H
hokiecat
Lurker
That's way too much. Eichel didn't even get Eichel prices and he's a better player than Chychrun. The top 3 alone should seal the deal. We're talking about a good defenseman not a generational talent.
I saw this rumor on Yahoo (which I think is too little as I'd do it in a split second):
3. Jakob Chychrun, Arizona Coyotes
For the sake of Jakob Chychrun and him alone, the Coyotes should definitely try to trade the talented young blueliner.
It would definitely benefit Chychrun more than the organization to deal him, as 23-year-old rearguards who have top-pairing upside are hard to come by, but considering the abysmal state of Arizona's roster, trading him could really help accelerate the rebuild, too.
Chychrun carries a very affordable yearly cap hit of $4,600,000 through the 2024-25 campaign, and is coming off a season where he recorded 18 goals and 41 points in 56 contests. Arizona already holds eight draft picks through the first two rounds of the upcoming draft, and dealing Chychrun would certainly net it some more draft capital and prospects.
Mock Trade
Coyotes acquire: Rasmus Kupari, Trevor Moore, Los Angeles Kings 1st (2022), Los Angeles Kings 2nd (2023)
Kings acquire: Jakob Chychrun, San Jose Sharks 4th (2024)
Helvetica
Top Forward
that's an insane ask. I get that Eichel was injured, and there's some risk there, but he's also a bonafide 1C. I have no doubt Chychrun is a good, even great, top pairing D. But he's not proven, and he's probably a tier below a guy like Eichel. Pull Clarke out of that ask and i'd probably do it, but the inclusion of Clarke feels like too much.
- Turcotte
- 2022 1st
- Kupari
- one of our MANY forward prospects in Ontario.
Is there any other team likely to put together a comparable offer to this?
J
jt
Lurker
Ok, so if another GM is willing to pay that price, you'd pass and try to find a "dynamic LD" somewhere else? Or would you just pass on trading for one and hope one of the young D develops into that? I'm asking because I doubt they'd trade him for that little...I think they'd just keep him, especially without a D coming back to them. And given what D go for, another GM would definitely pay that price.
Keep in mind that if you just sit tight and don't trade several of the young forwards, the Kings will just start losing them on waivers.
J
jt
Lurker
I disagree about Eichel. I think there was (and still is) bonafide risk that he will never play high end hockey again or that one hit ends his career (that's a bigger risk than any other player's career ending from one hit).
Sure, he's not proven but that's when you jump at a guy you believe can be a legit top D. If you wait until he's proven you have to pay Karlsson prices.
Same question to you...
If another GM is willing to pay that price, you'd pass and try to find a "dynamic LD" somewhere else? Or would you just pass on trading for one and hope one of the young D develops into that? If they don't start trading the kids, they'll start losing them on waivers.
As for Clarke, he was left of the WJC for a reason. Is that the guy to hold up a trade for a 23 yr old cost-controlled D who scored 12 goals in 63 and 18 goals in 56 games? (BTW, I think that shows he is proven, but that's another discussion)?
Not one of Turcotte, Kupari, Clarke or the 2022 1st is likely to be a top-end talent.
