FA 2025 (lets get the discussions in one thread)

[DoubleMinor]

I wanted Perbix but there weren’t many options. Ceci was available. Hiller doesn’t like Spence. Holland has history with Ceci, and he overpaid as one does for UFAs.

It’s extra concerning because we already have Edmundson. I don’t like it but one thing that has made Vegas effective on D apart from real skill is ample size. It’s harder to navigate around bigger bodies. There’s potential under the Kings’ system the d isn’t “better” per se but harder to play against when it matters.

Ugh. I parroted that term. But whatever. That’s the idea.

While I don’t disagree that the Ceci contract seems a bit much, both in salary and term, I also think the 4.5 salary is a bit overplayed.
With the cap increasing salaries will also.
Through the next few years and the cap going up, the 4.5 is probably the equivalent of around 3-3.5 in recent years. That doesn’t seem outlandish to me.
Really, we will see if Ceci can fit the system. If he can this salary is fine. 4.5 is not the same as it was last year, or how it will be two years from now.

 

[Birdman]

for

While I don’t disagree that the Ceci contract seems a bit much, both in salary and term, I also think the 4.5 salary is a bit overplayed.
With the cap increasing salaries will also.
Through the next few years and the cap going up, the 4.5 is probably the equivalent of around 3-3.5 in recent years. That doesn’t seem outlandish to me.
Really, we will see if Ceci can fit the system. If he can this salary is fine. 4.5 is not the same as it was last year, or how it will be two years from now.

For context, Vilardi just got $7.5M per season after racking up only 60 points last season, and is going to miss 10 games per season.

 

[DoubleMinor]

for

For context, Vilardi just got $7.5M per season after racking up only 60 points last season, and is going to miss 10 games per season.

I really expected to see higher salaries immediately but that hasn’t been the case except in a limited way.
Vilardi is a real interesting contract. It was a risky term given his history. The dollars don’t necessarily reflect his talent. But the Jets picked him up at an acceptable cap hit and Vilardi is now guaranteed 40+ million.

 

[DoubleMinor]

for

For context, Vilardi just got $7.5M per season after racking up only 60 points last season, and is going to miss 10 games per season.

10 games in a healthy season

 

[spudboy]

Easy to follow the crowd on hating Holland. The fact is the Kings are deeper in every area. Much of the blame should be put on Blake for losing Gavrikov and Spence. Hopefully, Hiller has learned lessons that there are consequences for his coaching decisions. And, stop with the 11-7 already. He should be able to roll 4 lines, and 3 D pairs regularly. BTW, Spence has not produced according to his talent level, 8 career goals. Not sure why Hiller couldn't play a regular season +23 player more than 7 1/2 minutes a game in the playoffs, though. Also, how did Hiller, a PP specialist coach, allow this PP to drop to bottom of the league. Also, Hiller lowering Gavrikov's responsibilities in the playoffs made him want to go elsewhere.

 

[Clif]

While I don’t disagree that the Ceci contract seems a bit much, both in salary and term, I also think the 4.5 salary is a bit overplayed.
With the cap increasing salaries will also.
Through the next few years and the cap going up, the 4.5 is probably the equivalent of around 3-3.5 in recent years. That doesn’t seem outlandish to me.
Really, we will see if Ceci can fit the system. If he can this salary is fine. 4.5 is not the same as it was last year, or how it will be two years from now.

I don’t take issue with the money, though I don’t like the term. If he does okay though I could see a team wanting to trade a late pick for him if Kings are able to improve RD sooner then when his four years are up. I think the same about Edmundson. He’s looked good enough on the Kings someone would take the veteran experience and size if he were made available.

I am concerned that Ceci will be a slow liability who can’t clear the puck out the zone. I’d be less concerned if I could count on blockhead Hiller to give him sheltered minutes, but Clarke needs to come in and really force his way onto the second pair. I can’t imagine Hiller not eyeing Ceci as anything but his second pair RD as of now.

 

[Statue4Deano]

I don’t take issue with the money, though I don’t like the term. If he does okay though I could see a team wanting to trade a late pick for him if Kings are able to improve RD sooner then when his four years are up. I think the same about Edmundson. He’s looked good enough on the Kings someone would take the veteran experience and size if he were made available.

I am concerned that Ceci will be a slow liability who can’t clear the puck out the zone. I’d be less concerned if I could count on blockhead Hiller to give him sheltered minutes, but Clarke needs to come in and really force his way onto the second pair. I can’t imagine Hiller not eyeing Ceci as anything but his second pair RD as of now.

Edmundson did look good in the Kings system. I think we need to acknowledge that he just had a career year at age 31. It’s completely unreasonable to assume he’ll repeat his play next season and going forward.

 

[Clif]

Edmundson did look good in the Kings system. I think we need to acknowledge that he just had a career year at age 31. It’s completely unreasonable to assume he’ll repeat his play next season and going forward.

I definitely see him scoring fewer goals! But Hiller can’t load him up with those minutes. My hope is for a Dumoulin Clarke second pair and a sheltered Edmundson Ceci pair. And close my eyes when they are on the ice together.

 

[DoubleMinor]

I don’t take issue with the money, though I don’t like the term. If he does okay though I could see a team wanting to trade a late pick for him if Kings are able to improve RD sooner then when his four years are up. I think the same about Edmundson. He’s looked good enough on the Kings someone would take the veteran experience and size if he were made available.

I am concerned that Ceci will be a slow liability who can’t clear the puck out the zone. I’d be less concerned if I could count on blockhead Hiller to give him sheltered minutes, but Clarke needs to come in and really force his way onto the second pair. I can’t imagine Hiller not eyeing Ceci as anything but his second pair RD as of now.

I agree with the concerns about Ceci and I do share them.
One big question is where Clarke slots this season. Is he a guaranteed #2? I don’t know. Was Ceci brought in to be insurance in the event Clarke needs more time?

The predicament was whether Clarke could quickly become a lock on the second pair. And it’s what (imo) caused Spence to get moved. Spence is not a legit #2. Clarke is a question. Even Doughty is a question to a degree.
Ceci gave the Kings a bit of flexibility with those questions.
Two years from now I could see both Clarke & Spence on the team. But unless and until Clarke gets to at least a solid #2 there was no place for Spence.
The one thing that helps me with the Ceci situation is that I believe he is easily moved if/when there is more clarity.

 

[McSorleyFan]

Backseat coach here. Here's how I'd see the D pairings:
1st Pair: Doughty–Anderson – veteran anchor with a puck-transition partner
2nd Pair: Edmundson–Ceci – heavy, physical duo who logs solid minutes
3rd Pair: Dumoulin–Clarke – conservative, puck-moving depth duo

Extras: Moverare and Burroughs rotate in for spot starts/injuries

PP I'd have Clarke on 2nd paring with Edmundson/Ceci

 

[DryKing]

I agree with the concerns about Ceci and I do share them.
One big question is where Clarke slots this season. Is he a guaranteed #2? I don’t know. Was Ceci brought in to be insurance in the event Clarke needs more time?

The predicament was whether Clarke could quickly become a lock on the second pair. And it’s what (imo) caused Spence to get moved. Spence is not a legit #2. Clarke is a question. Even Doughty is a question to a degree.
Ceci gave the Kings a bit of flexibility with those questions.
Two years from now I could see both Clarke & Spence on the team. But unless and until Clarke gets to at least a solid #2 there was no place for Spence.
The one thing that helps me with the Ceci situation is that I believe he is easily moved if/when there is more clarity.

I think Clarke is a legit 2nd pairing at this point. Sure he will have growing pains, and possibly a sophmore slump, but in an ideal world he is a future 2nd line pairing with Mikey (provided the Kings are able to bring in the talent to dethrone Mikey off the 1st line).

Additionally only Doughty and Clarke can consistently generate offense from our backline so that makes both of them very valuable. I don't see a strong OD candidate in our prospect pool either so the Kings really need to go all-in on Clarke next season to build his experience and give him key minutes.

This is also why I do not like the Spence trade. Spence provided a third option as he had shown his ability to generate offense while with the Reign and when given the opportunity to do so at the NHL level. Spence has a game that will keep getting better, with the only thing lacking being size.

 

[Statue4Deano]

I agree with the concerns about Ceci and I do share them.
One big question is where Clarke slots this season. Is he a guaranteed #2? I don’t know. Was Ceci brought in to be insurance in the event Clarke needs more time?

The predicament was whether Clarke could quickly become a lock on the second pair. And it’s what (imo) caused Spence to get moved. Spence is not a legit #2. Clarke is a question. Even Doughty is a question to a degree.
Ceci gave the Kings a bit of flexibility with those questions.
Two years from now I could see both Clarke & Spence on the team. But unless and until Clarke gets to at least a solid #2 there was no place for Spence.
The one thing that helps me with the Ceci situation is that I believe he is easily moved if/when there is more clarity.

I think we’re all deluding ourselves if we’re writing Clarke’s name in ink on the 2nd pair. it’s very likely that Ceci plays more minutes per night than Clarke for the entirety of this season/playoffs because we know how much Hiller needs his vets on the ice to feel comfortable.

 

[DryKing]

I think we’re all deluding ourselves if we’re writing Clarke’s name in ink on the 2nd pair. it’s very likely that Ceci plays more minutes per night than Clarke for the entirety of this season/playoffs because we know how much Hiller needs his vets on the ice to feel comfortable.

Agreed. I am hoping Clarke averages at least 18 minutes per game, though, and is utilized against higher level competition in order to facilitate quicker growth. It'll be interesting to see how the minutes break out given the Kings added two minute eaters to the roster and only removed one.

 

[What party?]

Have we secretly made peace with our FA Signings?

View attachment 12520

I thought my favorite "reimaging" of this meme would be the Breaking Bad version: Skyler and Ted. But, this one is a little funnier.

 

[DoubleMinor]

I think Clarke is a legit 2nd pairing at this point. Sure he will have growing pains, and possibly a sophmore slump, but in an ideal world he is a future 2nd line pairing with Mikey (provided the Kings are able to bring in the talent to dethrone Mikey off the 1st line).

Additionally only Doughty and Clarke can consistently generate offense from our backline so that makes both of them very valuable. I don't see a strong OD candidate in our prospect pool either so the Kings really need to go all-in on Clarke next season to build his experience and give him key minutes.

This is also why I do not like the Spence trade. Spence provided a third option as he had shown his ability to generate offense while with the Reign and when given the opportunity to do so at the NHL level. Spence has a game that will keep getting better, with the only thing lacking being size.

As I said recently the Kings definitely need to give Clarke the keys this season. I agree that he has the potential to be #2 and it’s time to find out. But it’s not a certainty in my mind, although I’m very hopeful.
It looks to me that either there was concern within the org about Clarke OR (more likely) that the org had soured on Spence.
I do think Spence lack of size is the biggest concern. But it’s clearly not just that.
Hiller lost confidence in Spence. Whether that was warranted I couldn’t possibly know. Did Hiller instruct Spence and was ignored? Was there some intangible or technical aspect that created the situation? Again I wouldn’t know.

I do think this Spence situation is similar in a way to Roy and Durzi. The org thought neither were worth the 6M/plus a year and chose to walk away from them. I suspect the calculation on Spence was similar and expedited the walk-away.

 

[DryKing]

As I said recently the Kings definitely need to give Clarke the keys this season. I agree that he has the potential to be #2 and it’s time to find out. But it’s not a certainty in my mind, although I’m very hopeful.
It looks to me that either there was concern within the org about Clarke OR (more likely) that the org had soured on Spence.
I do think Spence lack of size is the biggest concern. But it’s clearly not just that.
Hiller lost confidence in Spence. Whether that was warranted I couldn’t possibly know. Did Hiller instruct Spence and was ignored? Was there some intangible or technical aspect that created the situation? Again I wouldn’t know.

I do think this Spence situation is similar in a way to Roy and Durzi. The org thought neither were worth the 6M/plus a year and chose to walk away from them. I suspect the calculation on Spence was similar and expedited the walk-away.

Personally I still think Hiller has too much power for the coach who has yet to win a single playoff round in the NHL. This is a coach that tried to cheat code his way to the 2nd round and it blew up in his face, and simply being outcoached the previous season during the playoffs. Feels more like HIller lost confidence in himself, rather than Spence, which caused him to move away from many of the things that made the team successful during the regular season. In the process he deteriorated the trust certain players had in him which caused a divide.

I agree there are still concerns with Clarke in terms of his defensive play and ability to handle physical/dirty games (being able to be physical himself, absorbing hits and having the discipline to avoid being goaded). HIs first full season was far more successful than many thought it would be, however, and I don't believe there are any concerns when it comes to skill.

 

[DoubleMinor]

Personally I still think Hiller has too much power for the coach who has yet to win a single playoff round in the NHL. This is a coach that tried to cheat code his way to the 2nd round and it blew up in his face, and simply being outcoached the previous season during the playoffs. Feels more like HIller lost confidence in himself, rather than Spence, which caused him to move away from many of the things that made the team successful during the regular season. In the process he deteriorated the trust certain players had in him which caused a divide.

I agree there are still concerns with Clarke in terms of his defensive play and ability to handle physical/dirty games (being able to be physical himself, absorbing hits and having the discipline to avoid being goaded). HIs first full season was far more successful than many thought it would be, however, and I don't believe there are any concerns when it comes to skill.

I know there is significant concern with some about Hiller. While I’m not an apologist for him I am very curious how he does this next season. It’s make or break for Hiller. But I still have reason to believe he can coach this team. Time will certainly tell on that.
With regard to Clarke I think there are questions but I’m in his corner. I want him to succeed. I think he has a ceiling that is very, very high. I don’t know how quickly he gets there though. But again, he needs every opportunity possible.

 

[santiclaws]

I thought my favorite "reimaging" of this meme would be the Breaking Bad version: Skyler and Ted. But, this one is a little funnier.

At least 80% of the time I have no idea what the f*** you're talking about. Don't ever change!

 

[Bollocks]

As I said recently the Kings definitely need to give Clarke the keys this season. I agree that he has the potential to be #2 and it’s time to find out. But it’s not a certainty in my mind, although I’m very hopeful.
It looks to me that either there was concern within the org about Clarke OR (more likely) that the org had soured on Spence.
I do think Spence lack of size is the biggest concern. But it’s clearly not just that.
Hiller lost confidence in Spence. Whether that was warranted I couldn’t possibly know. Did Hiller instruct Spence and was ignored? Was there some intangible or technical aspect that created the situation? Again I wouldn’t know.

I do think this Spence situation is similar in a way to Roy and Durzi. The org thought neither were worth the 6M/plus a year and chose to walk away from them. I suspect the calculation on Spence was similar and expedited the walk-away.

It's entirely likely that Roy knew he would likely not be a 2nd pairing guy with Clarke on the team and simply didn't want to sign a short term deal (which is entirely reasonable). I don't know why people are calling that "letting him walk away". There probably was no reasonable way of preventing that scenario.

 

[What party?]

At least 80% of the time I have no idea what the f*** you're talking about. Don't ever change!

I like the implication that you think I can. Awe. So sweet.