Hiller Hotseat Thread

Birdman said:
Just for fun, lets say that the Matthews trade rumors are true and we are a destination of choice.

Would you back up the truck and give them what they want, assuming it would cost Byfield, Clarke, Greentree, Woolley, and a 2026 1st?
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I personally would do it if you remove Clarke and Woolley and instead add Doughty
 
LA Kings are stuck in a groundhog day scenario. Make the playoffs, lose 1st round, tweak the roster a bit, repeat.
Season GP W L OTL Points Comments
2020-21562128749Shortened season; no playoff appearance
2021-228244271199Returned to playoffs (lost in first round)
2022-2382472510104Made playoffs (first-round exit)
2023-248244271199Playoff berth, eliminated in first round
2024-258248259105Second in Pacific Division; first-round playoff loss

Projections this season will be around 88 points and a tough fought wildcard placing. Meet a #1 seed and probably a 1st round exit (again).
With Kopitar being gone, no bonafide 1C it's time to blow it up. Oilers (if they keep McJesus), Colorado, Dallas, LV, Wild, are all going to be too tough to get past in the playoffs for a while. Meanwhile, Kings will lose ground to Chi, Ducks Sharks, Kraken, Mammoth who are keeping to their rebuild.
 
McSorleyFan said:
LA Kings are stuck in a groundhog day scenario. Make the playoffs, lose 1st round, tweak the roster a bit, repeat.
Season GP W L OTL Points Comments
2020-21562128749Shortened season; no playoff appearance
2021-228244271199Returned to playoffs (lost in first round)
2022-2382472510104Made playoffs (first-round exit)
2023-248244271199Playoff berth, eliminated in first round
2024-258248259105Second in Pacific Division; first-round playoff loss

Projections this season will be around 88 points and a tough fought wildcard placing. Meet a #1 seed and probably a 1st round exit (again).
With Kopitar being gone, no bonafide 1C it's time to blow it up. Oilers (if they keep McJesus), Colorado, Dallas, LV, Wild, are all going to be too tough to get past in the playoffs for a while. Meanwhile, Kings will lose ground to Chi, Ducks Sharks, Kraken, Mammoth who are keeping to their rebuild.
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Jammer look! A spreadsheet!
 
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Clif said:
The reasons you listed are exactly why owners don’t like rebuilds. And Kings did rebuild, just on an accelerated schedule. But 2018 was an absolute tear-down so to say Luc avoids them is simply inaccurate.

It didn’t lead to success. Luc and Blake failed, and Hiller failed most of all.

It’s a rare thing to begin a second rebuild within 10 years. No ownership group would be comfortable with that.

Now at this point if it makes people feel better to weave a narrative that somehow this team is just all about profits and just being status quo only, I’m the idiot to keep arguing with them. Hockey is hard, making the playoffs is harder, building a winner is hardest. Luc and Blake had a flawed vision that happened to produce a playoff team that couldn’t beat the same team 4 years in a row.

And now the team needs to seriously change in philosophy as Simple Jim drags along its tired corpse across the barren tundra of hockey hell in a system so insulting as its built on fear and avoidance we just need him to go away and begin the healing process. Missing the playoffs would be ideal, but I think even another first round exit could do the trick for Luc.
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At that point Luc wasn't a seasoned executive, and Rob even less so.

I'm still of the opinion that they intentionally sabotaged the team by hiring Willie-D so that they put the team owners in a position of no other choice but to green-light a heavy retool.

The team still had its main core intact, there was some talent and with a proper coach they'd make the playoffs, but the prospect cupboard really lacked top-end talent with meaningful trade value so there was little room to improve the team if that situation continued. In comes Willie-D.

I'm pretty sure if Luc proposed to the owners the idea of a heavy retool before things fell apart with Willie-D, he'd get told to f*** off with that nonsense.



Now, this team is considerably better (especially from depth standpoint) on paper than it was then, and there ARE some young prospects with higher end talent and there are QB and Clarke already on the team. There's little chance the owners green-light another rebuild/heavy retool now, and Luc won't force it like he did back then if he wants to keep his job. He already busted his "bonus" of a retool.
 
Bollocks said:
At that point Luc wasn't a seasoned executive, and Rob even less so.

I'm still of the opinion that they intentionally sabotaged the team by hiring Willie-D so that they put the team owners in a position of no other choice but to green-light a heavy retool.

The team still had its main core intact, there was some talent and with a proper coach they'd make the playoffs, but the prospect cupboard really lacked top-end talent with meaningful trade value so there was little room to improve the team if that situation continued. In comes Willie-D.

I'm pretty sure if Luc proposed to the owners the idea of a heavy retool before things fell apart with Willie-D, he'd get told to f*** off with that nonsense.



Now, this team is considerably better (especially from depth standpoint) on paper than it was then, and there ARE some young prospects with higher end talent and there are QB and Clarke already on the team. There's little chance the owners green-light another rebuild/heavy retool now, and Luc won't force it like he did back then if he wants to keep his job. He already busted his "bonus" of a retool.
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Self-sabotage to sell a rebuild is still a rebuild. Speculation aside, a rebuild happened under Luc. Full-on, blow-it-up rebuild in 2018. Not a retool, though time-wise it was closer to a retool. More on that later.

NHL teams rely on ticket sales for 44% of their revenue. MLB 31%. NBA 26%. NFL 17%. NHL teams are also most reliant on concessions/parking revenues than the other leagues. Source here.

NHL owners hate rebuilds. They are expensive and risky. Freidman talked about PHI and SJ going into their rebuilds kicking and screaming, despite multiple years of mediocrity.

Exercise:
1) Name me an NHL team who started a rebuild in the midst of multiple seasons as a playoff team.
2) Name me an NHL team who started two different rebuilds within a 10 year period.

Once fans are in the building, owners aren’t excited to send them away and hope they return. The lesser the hockey market, the higher aversion yet.

Kings will need to retool. They will not blow it up. Sorry. They will not.

What happened? A lot of things:

1) Hastened rebuild. NYR fell into the same trap after signing Panarin.
2) Cal fell apart and the goalie pipeline had been neglected. This was one of the Blake’s greatest failures. Bad luck and worse planning.
3) Too many prospects failed to materialize.
3a) Blake failed to trade some when they had value. Not all will pan out. Must take risks.
4) An incoherent team vision. Blake neglected size and physicality for too long while over-emphasizing speed and skill. Then in concert with coaching employed a trap system out of step with the modern game not to mention much of their own roster.
5) PLD. Yes, we have Kuemper now. But the hemorrhaging of assets plus a lost year and cultural collapse are still impacting the team.
6) Bad luck in facing a team who has their number four years in a row powered by the two best players in the world during their prime. Different tiers but similarly MN could never beat StL for consecutive years either.
7) Jim Hiller. Finally could have beaten the aforementioned team above last season if not for simple Jim.
7a) Retaining Hiller after the playoff collapse. Inexplicable.

Things go wrong in a rebuild but this is a whole lot of wrong. Lots to talk about there, but some people insist that the problem is an ownership group who just wants to turn a profit, like that’s some kind of anomaly. The people the org hired to do the job failed.
 
I think we just need to accept that Hiller ain’t going anywhere until the summer.

Right now I believe Holland is focused on finding a Center. I’ve been keeping an eye on Zacha in Boston. Bruins have been sputtering and they’re now out of a playoff spot.

If Boston makes him available I could see Holland going all in.
 
Clif said:
Self-sabotage to sell a rebuild is still a rebuild. Speculation aside, a rebuild happened under Luc. Full-on, blow-it-up rebuild in 2018. Not a retool, though time-wise it was closer to a retool. More on that later.

NHL teams rely on ticket sales for 44% of their revenue. MLB 31%. NBA 26%. NFL 17%. NHL teams are also most reliant on concessions/parking revenues than the other leagues. Source here.

NHL owners hate rebuilds. They are expensive and risky. Freidman talked about PHI and SJ going into their rebuilds kicking and screaming, despite multiple years of mediocrity.

Exercise:
1) Name me an NHL team who started a rebuild in the midst of multiple seasons as a playoff team.
2) Name me an NHL team who started two different rebuilds within a 10 year period.

Once fans are in the building, owners aren’t excited to send them away and hope they return. The lesser the hockey market, the higher aversion yet.

Kings will need to retool. They will not blow it up. Sorry. They will not.

What happened? A lot of things:

1) Hastened rebuild. NYR fell into the same trap after signing Panarin.
2) Cal fell apart and the goalie pipeline had been neglected. This was one of the Blake’s greatest failures. Bad luck and worse planning.
3) Too many prospects failed to materialize.
3a) Blake failed to trade some when they had value. Not all will pan out. Must take risks.
4) An incoherent team vision. Blake neglected size and physicality for too long while over-emphasizing speed and skill. Then in concert with coaching employed a trap system out of step with the modern game not to mention much of their own roster.
5) PLD. Yes, we have Kuemper now. But the hemorrhaging of assets plus a lost year and cultural collapse are still impacting the team.
6) Bad luck in facing a team who has their number four years in a row powered by the two best players in the world during their prime. Different tiers but similarly MN could never beat StL for consecutive years either.
7) Jim Hiller. Finally could have beaten the aforementioned team above last season if not for simple Jim.
7a) Retaining Hiller after the playoff collapse. Inexplicable.

Things go wrong in a rebuild but this is a whole lot of wrong. Lots to talk about there, but some people insist that the problem is an ownership group who just wants to turn a profit, like that’s some kind of anomaly. The people the org hired to do the job failed.
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Arguably making the playoffs for as often as the Kings did post retool/rebuild could be considered a success...

Bottom line is - we're not going to see a rebuild anytime soon, I agree. Unless the fans stop going to the games in big enough numbers. But we all know that's not happening either...
 
What party? said:
The picture of Todd is both a knife twist and mirroring how I am taking the news of his success.
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Eh...let them boast when they mamage to win a PO series.

Todd did a fine job to coach the Kings from a rebuilding bottom to playoffs. He failed to bring more out of the team when they were there. Sure, bad luck with having to go against the Oilers and the team wasn't perfect, but Todd hit a coaching wall and had to go.
 
Statue4Deano said:
I think we just need to accept that Hiller ain’t going anywhere until the summer.

Right now I believe Holland is focused on finding a Center. I’ve been keeping an eye on Zacha in Boston. Bruins have been sputtering and they’re now out of a playoff spot.

If Boston makes him available I could see Holland going all in.
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Throw in Pasta and let's get nuts with it!
 
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